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Pensions

My Lords, I thank everyone who has taken part in this debate for their speeches. I thank the noble Baronesses, Lady Pitkeathley and Lady Greengross. I also thank my noble friends Lord Freeman, Lord Hunt of Wirral and Lord Trenchard for their contributions. I thank my noble friend Lord Hodgson who set out the plight of the private sector and trustees. As he said, the noble Lord, Lord Desai, was not present to hear the Minister winding up the debate but that is cancelled out by the fact that the noble Baroness, Lady Hollis, who was not present at the beginning of the debate, is here for the wind-up. I thank her for that. I address my next remarks to the noble Lord, Lord Lea, the noble Baroness, Lady Turner, and the noble Lord, Lord Hunt. I welcome the noble Lord, Lord Hunt, to his new position but I did not find his reply on public sector pensions at all convincing. I have to tell him that the policy to increase the retirement age in the public sector for existing staff was not my policy but the Government’s. The Government have now retreated from that policy. As the noble Lords, Lord Kirkwood and Lord Oakeshott, and my noble friend Lord Skelmersdale said, the demographic message is beyond challenge: that means tackling the age of retirement. However—I say this to the noble Lord, Lord Rosser, in particular—you cannot change it for one group and not for another. You cannot change it for the private sector and not for the public sector. That is unfair and unjust. We will come back to these issues with passion. I thank everyone who has taken part in the debate for their contributions. I beg leave to withdraw the Motion. Motion for Papers, by leave, withdrawn.