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Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974 (Exceptions) (Amendment) (England and Wales) Order 2007

I am grateful to noble Lords for their comments on this order. The noble Lord, Lord Henley, asked: why not simply overhaul and consolidate the exceptions order? We intend to take that step to coincide with the launch of the new vetting and barring scheme in the autumn of 2008. The exception order will be aligned with the provisions of the Safeguarding Vulnerable Groups Act. The noble Lord, Lord Thomas of Gresford, made a fascinating contribution to the debate. It is very difficult to disagree with anything he said. He said that we should encourage rehabilitation and resettlement in relation to Breaking the Circle. There is a temptation, he argued, with these orders simply to keep adding. The important point about the order is that it is aimed at protecting children and vulnerable adults. Although we take on board his legitimate concerns, we are very mindful, as I am sure he is, to protect the principle of rehabilitation. However, we have to balance the needs of protection, in particular with children, especially in the light of the Bichard report which followed on the terrible events in Soham. The points made by the noble Lord are very well taken, but we cannot take any risks with our children or vulnerable adults. This presents a problem, which we have to continue discussing, because if you have offended against children, it is very difficult to imagine circumstances in which you should be allowed to work with children again. At the same time, you are then dealing with a group of people who perhaps stand no chance of getting another job, which comes back to a very important point the noble Lord made. The noble Lord, Lord Thomas, also asked why it was necessary to put in the order about the Commissioner for Older People in Wales. The role of the commissioner is likely to involve significant unsupervised contact with and indirect access to potentially a large number of older people in the normal course of his or her duties. This is an innovative post which will be the focus of attention and scrutiny at the highest level. It is therefore imperative that risks are not taken, no matter how small. The noble Lord, Lord Hylton, asked what Nacro’s response was to the proposed amendments. We engaged in a very useful dialogue with Nacro. For example, it expressed concerns that the exception order needed to draw a balance between the rights of ex-offenders and the need to protect vulnerable groups; we have already discussed that matter. We feel that this order strikes that balance very well. The noble Lord, Lord Hylton, also asked whether disclosure of previous convictions still allows job applications to be considered. It is a matter for the employer as to what they do, if any weight is to be given to such disclosures. Employers are encouraged to have a policy for the employment of ex-offenders. Amendments were made to the exception order as a result of these discussions. I commend the order. On Question, Motion agreed to.