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Ministers and Civil Servants

The hon. Gentleman and I are still like ships passing in the night, despite his best efforts to forge consensus. What he is missing is that having a large number of advisers changes the culture at the heart of Whitehall. Small numbers of advisers may keep their heads down, knowing that if they overstep the mark—the Prime Minister will have approved each appointment, as used to occur during the Thatcher years—they will be out on their ear. Their relationship is different from that of the civil service, and of advisers who are brought in to be pretty much the doorkeeper to a Minister, which is what many current advisers and those of the past 10 years have been. When I was a member of the hon. Gentleman's Committee—it may have been immediately before he was the Chairman—we had before us Lord Butler, who was then Cabinet Secretary. He did his best to defend the Orders in Council that he gave for Jonathan Powell to effectively take over No. 10. He tried to pretend that the existing structure was exactly the same and that Jonathan Powell was a bolt-on extra who provided added value. I asked Lord Butler where Jonathan Powell sat in the room and he said, ““Well, he sits at a desk in the private secretary's office.”” I said, ““Yes, but which desk?”” Of course, I happened to know the geography of the room quite well, and he said, ““Well, the desk in the top left-hand corner.”” I said, ““That's the desk always occupied by the principal private secretary who runs No. 10.”” So he has displaced that person. Indeed, that is the doorkeeper position—geographically and in every other way—and it is right by the door to the Cabinet room. Lord Butler said, ““Yes.”” I then asked him whether he thought the geography of a room ever played a role in deciding where power lies and, quietly, he nodded his agreement. That is what is meant by a takeover of the roles formerly played by special advisers, which is certainly what went on during the Blair years.