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Public Transport (Disabled Access)

I thank the right hon. Gentleman for that. I shall dwell on that theme later. It is one thing to pass laws and to talk about disability in this place and elsewhere, but we have to get through to the general public on a wider scale than we are doing at present. In my own case, having a disabled mother and, before he passed away, a disabled father, I suddenly became much more aware of the problems. Without drifting too much, too often one goes to a place and asks, "Do you have accessibility for wheelchairs?" and what we hear is, "Yes, there are only three or four steps." There is still a mentality among many people, unless they have had to get a wheelchair in and out, that things are not as difficult as they actually are. I agree with the right hon. Gentleman that access and fair treatment on any form of transport are important. He mentioned buses, which I shall discuss. I do not want to be entirely negative. One positive thing that I have noticed over the years, going up and down on the underground and buses—again, I am quoting from experience in London—are the audiovisual announcements, particularly on the buses. Previously, it was sometimes difficult for a person to know where they were, even if they were fully sighted and able—the bus could be crowded, or the windows could be misted up—so they are an improvement for all passengers. But for those who have problems, they are vital. I believe that the Transport Committee recently produced a report on transport for the Olympics, and that it recommended that all transport should have such announcements. It is obvious that not just disabled people would benefit from them: they would be of benefit to locals and certainly will be important to the huge number of tourists who will come in. I would like that system to be extended to all buses throughout the country. A problem with buses that I believe is probably common around the country is that many now have disabled space—in effect, space for a wheelchair—but it is limited, and those wheelchair spaces are sometimes taken up by other passengers, most obviously those with children's buggies or prams. I got a copy of a letter from TfL, which says that it encourages its drivers to ask people to move, but that they do not have powers to insist that people move. It is a matter of asking and trying to make people aware. Sometimes, the great British public are not as understanding as we would like them to be. Many people may have experienced this. People may be under pressure themselves—it is not easy taking a buggy around with a lot of shopping, a kid screaming away and all the rest—but we should try to ensure that space is available. If the place on the bus is taken and a wheelchair cannot get in because there is no space—this assumes that the ramp is working and so on—the person has to wait for the next bus, and the next one if that one has no space. Interestingly, I noticed that a local person recently had an out-of-court settlement from a bus operating company—I believe they got £1,000—because they could not access four consecutive buses. For most of us, that situation rarely occurs, although sometimes a bus is too full and it speeds past, but for a disabled person sitting in a wheelchair and trying to get on a bus, it must be problematic. Again, I am speaking about London, where the bus services are quite regular. I would imagine that elsewhere this could be a real problem if the next bus is not for half an hour or so. These are problems for disabled people. As I said in response to the intervention by the right hon. Member for Coatbridge, Chryston and Bellshill (Mr. Clarke), the public are sometimes surprisingly unsympathetic to the needs of disabled people. As Members of this House, we are very much aware of them because people come to us with their concerns. There are awareness campaigns and courses for bus drivers, and most drivers are helpful, but unfortunately, as with most things, there will be one or two who are not. Something that never occurred to me until it was pointed out, when it became obvious, is the problem at request stops for those who are visually impaired. We take things for granted—we see a bus coming along, we see the number on it and we stick our hand out to stop it—but that is a problem for someone who has problems with their sight. I do not think that we appreciate quite how difficult that is. The Government's statutory advisory committee, the disabled persons transport advisory committee, has found that although disabled people travel a third less often than non-disabled people, they have a greater reliance on the bus services. That committee produced figures showing that, within the disability community, blind and partially sighted people use buses significantly more than other disabled people, with 50 per cent. taking the bus at least once a month compared with 43 per cent. of other disabled people. That is why request stops and announcements are so important. We forget that the black cabs are a form of public transport. Disabled people can find them useful in getting from A to B, but one obvious problem is the expense. Mr. Allen Bergson, whom I mentioned earlier, told me about the real problems and how, in many cases, it is cheaper to fly to Spain and back than to get a black cab. For example, Mr. Bergson lives in Hillingdon and it cost him £80.11 one way to go to the National hospital in Holborn for some drug trials. Without being too intelligent I can work out what the return trip would cost. Booking fees and credit card charges lead to a black cab costing more for disabled people than for able-bodied people because one with wheelchair facilities has to be booked. Although sometimes they can flag one down, the chances are that the first one that comes along may not be accessible. So the cost of what we might think is a relatively easy journey becomes hugely problematic. In providing accessibility for people with disabilities, we want to try to enable them to lead as normal a life as possible, getting out and enjoying things and getting on with work. Work is another big problem, because transport is not that easy for disabled people to use. At our DASH meetings we have endless discussions about Dial-a-ride, which provides a useful service but also leads to many complaints. It is a patchy service. People from Dial-a-ride come along to the meetings to try to explain what is going on. There is so much frustration. For example, people can book an outward trip but are unable to book the return journey, which makes the whole thing pointless. Having mentioned some of the obvious problems, I should like to mention that, having been granted this debate, I was approached by the British Lung Foundation, which wanted me to raise the problem of charges for oxygen on airlines. Although I told them that this debate was about public transport, that is still a problem. It may be something for another day, but I should just like to flag it for the Minister and say that that is just another problem that people face. There are other examples in respect of airlines, including some not always being as sympathetic to wheelchair users as others. We should be concentrating on such things to try to let our constituents with disabilities enjoy as full a life as possible on as equal terms with ourselves as possible. I should like to bring to right hon. Members' attention the report on the findings of Trailblazers, which I am sure the Minister has seen, which involved 1,000 young people from the Muscular Dystrophy Campaign, who became, as I would say from my retail experience, mystery shoppers, trying to see how easy it was to do things on the transport systems. Those findings are all pretty obvious, but perhaps we should highlight the fact that disabled passengers often feel like second-class citizens and that they cannot, as I have mentioned already, always access the first bus, train or taxi. The assisted passenger registration service on the trains needs 24-hour advance booking, making the possibilities for more flexible travel—suddenly wanting to go somewhere on a train, for example—much more difficult. These are all problems that people face. As I said at the beginning, I acknowledge that things are and have been improving. Goodness knows that any of us could, and probably will, suddenly find ourselves with some disability. Although we can say that advances are being made, there is a need for urgency in respect of provision for disabled people, because their quality of life could be improved by improving disability facilities on public transport, and that would make a huge difference to them. As we come up to the Olympics and, more importantly, the Paralympics, we have a wonderful opportunity, all round the country, to ensure that we have some of the best public transport accessible to disabled people.