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Cluster Munitions (Prohibitions) Bill [HL]

My Lords, we come to really quite difficult parts of this basically excellent Bill, and I would value clarification in debating whether this clause should stand part of the Bill. I have heard it suggested, and I feel that there is validity in the suggestion, that greater clarity is needed about the legal status of our forces when they are in contact with cluster munitions and when working with other forces who belong to countries that have not signed up to this convention and that are still using cluster munitions of various kinds, or indeed kinds that may not yet have been developed but that will be brought on to the weapons scene in the future. I am sure that the Minister and your Lordships would all agree that it is undesirable that those of our fighting forces on the front line and in difficult and tense situations should be unclear at any point about what they are and are not allowed to do, especially when there is a shadow over them that they may be involved in illegal action if they take the wrong course or the wrong decision, even when under intense pressure and having to act at high speed. How will this interoperability, which is what we are talking about in Clause 9, and co-operation with visiting forces, allied forces or third countries be policed? What will the ramifications be if it is learnt that UK personnel are working with troops who are using cluster munitions due to the fact that the forces with whom they are operating still use these munitions? The convention explicitly attempts to aim at banning this type of situation, but here we are, legislating, so that we can sign this convention. Does our Bill do the same thing, or does it provide a loophole? The Minister in another place said at one stage that the convention, and therefore also the Bill, ""does not alter our ability to work with coalition partners"." We know that in the real world at present our coalition partners tend to be our American allies, but we may be moving into a world in which our partners will be from all sorts of other countries—they have been, to some extent, in Iraq: for example from Japan and the Ukraine. It is even conceivable in the world into which we are moving that we will have a more unified global approach to rogue activities and work with Russian troops or any others; I do not know. These are no longer quite the fantasies that they were. How do we ensure that our operations with our coalition partners proceed smoothly in the light of this new legislation? Are we sure that what the Minister said about our ability to work with our allies, particularly the Americans, being in no way compromised or altered is really so? I return to the question asked by the noble Lord, Lord Lee, a moment ago about how we continue to discourage the United States from its own continuing role in stockpiling cluster munitions in UK territories such as Diego Garcia. What will be the procedure by which the pressure of discouragement is brought to these situations? Will the Minister elaborate on how that will develop? Those are my reasons for seeking to question whether the clause should stand part.