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Debate on bill on Tuesday, 15 March 2011, in the House of Lords.

Fixed-term Parliaments Bill

Fixed-term Parliaments Bill. Clause 1: Polling days for parliamentary general elections, under consideration.

Secondary information

Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
726 c159-204, c218-30 
Session
2010-12
Department
Deputy Prime Minister
Committee of the Whole House (HL)
Legislative stage
Committee stage
Chamber / Committee
House of Lords chamber
Related items
Proceeding contributions
Earl of Onslow | 726 c192 (Link to this contribution) The Prime Minister has said, perfectly reasonably, that he thinks his Government will go on until 15...
Lord Wallace of Saltaire | 726 c192-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, my noble friend’s point goes to the heart of whether one should have a fixed-term Parliame...
Show all contributions (125)
Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 726 c194 (Link to this contribution) Far be it from me to suggest how the noble Baroness should answer questions about the merits of the ...
Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 726 c195 (Link to this contribution) Tempting though the honeyed words of the noble Lord are—that seems to be the phrase of the night—he ...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 726 c194 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble and learned Lord will know that the Government’s intention is that when the draf...
Lord Grocott | 726 c195-7 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I really am grateful for the contributions that have been made to this debate, not least b...
Lord Cormack | 726 c204 (Link to this contribution) Yes, of course, but I respectfully say that there should have been consultation before we got into t...
Lord Howarth of Newport | 726 c218 (Link to this contribution) 5: Clause 40, page 25, line 35, after ““not”” insert ““materially””
Lord Cormack | 726 c203 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, never has a probing amendment produced more in the way of disturbing information from my n...
Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 726 c203-4 (Link to this contribution) There are no discussions about what the date will be for what will no longer be the 2015 election. W...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 726 c201 (Link to this contribution) I shall make a short intervention. This has raised an important point. There is no doubt, as was sai...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 726 c203 (Link to this contribution) I am sorry that the noble Lord, Lord Marks, is not in his place because I presume that on that basis...
Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 726 c203 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I do not think that a referendum would be appropriate in those circumstances, not least be...
Lord Cormack | 726 c197 (Link to this contribution) 4: Clause 1, page 1, line 5, leave out ““7 May 2015”” and insert ““27 March 2015””
Lord Cormack | 726 c198 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I do not wish to detain your Lordships for long on this amendment. I am conscious that the...
Lord Empey | 726 c198 (Link to this contribution) I am very grateful to the noble Lord for giving way. His very thoughtful amendment is obviously desi...
Lord Cormack | 726 c199 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the noble Lord for his speech, rather than his intervention. This is very much an i...
Lord Howarth of Newport | 726 c199-200 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, Amendments 6 and 7 in this group, which are in my name, are also intended to try to avert ...
Baroness Hayter of Kentish Town | 726 c197 (Link to this contribution) It does bring the likelihood of coalition very much to the fore. Some people favour that and some do...
Lord Grocott | 726 c197 (Link to this contribution) I wish even more that we had had the benefit of a contribution from my noble friend and that she had...
Lord Norton of Louth | 726 c226 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the logic of my noble friend’s argument is that a Parliament might go for a full five year...
Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 726 c225-6 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, with all due respect, the noble Lord makes the mistake of trying to impose on a new situat...
Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 726 c224-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, again this amendment has stimulated an interesting debate, some of which goes into the gen...
Lord Martin of Springburn | 726 c225 (Link to this contribution) I am at a loss to understand why the Government do not go for four years. Another feature about a fi...
Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 726 c223 (Link to this contribution) I want to repeat a point I made on Second Reading, which does not seem to have been raised so far to...
Lord Grocott | 726 c223-4 (Link to this contribution) We need to address the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Brooke, which as ever was entirely valid, ...
Lord Cormack | 726 c223 (Link to this contribution) I make one brief point following the comments of the noble Lord, Lord Martin. Surely in a coalition ...
Lord Martin of Springburn | 726 c223 (Link to this contribution) Can I make the point that going beyond four years can be a double-edged sword for a Prime Minister? ...
Lord Pannick | 726 c220 (Link to this contribution) Before the Minister responds, I should like to add my response to these amendments and, indeed, to s...
Lord Martin of Springburn | 726 c221-2 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have a worry about the idea of a five-year Parliament. My experience of the other place ...
Lord Norton of Louth | 726 c222 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I share the view of the noble Lord, Lord Pannick, but I am motivated to follow the words o...
Lord Tyler | 726 c222-3 (Link to this contribution) We should be absolutely clear what precisely the amendments in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Howa...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 726 c219-20 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, that was an interesting and helpful intervention. Anyone who has read David Laws’s book on...
Lord Brooke of Sutton Mandeville | 726 c220 (Link to this contribution) I was not making any comment on the course of events. I was simply saying that interventions periodi...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 726 c220 (Link to this contribution) I do not recognise that at all. It is tempting to mention Mr Asquith, if only to encourage the noble...
Lord Howarth of Newport | 726 c218-9 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I hope that Amendments 5 and 9A will be of some interest to the House. They would introduc...
Lord Brooke of Sutton Mandeville | 726 c219 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I shall be extremely brief but I told myself that if anybody else brought Mr Asquith into ...
Lord Norton of Louth | 726 c227 (Link to this contribution) A Government who come in will have a programme for four years with the fifth year spent preparing fo...
Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 726 c227 (Link to this contribution) Is my noble friend asking whether it is impossible for a Government to devise a programme for five y...
Lord Cormack | 726 c227 (Link to this contribution) If the virtue of five years is to give more time to plan, and I accept the logic of that, why have w...
Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 726 c227 (Link to this contribution) If this Bill becomes law and there is a five-year Parliament, the Government of the day can expect t...
Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 726 c227 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, we have indicated that we will move towards a May Queen’s Speech. There is a legislative p...
Lord Tyler | 726 c230 (Link to this contribution) I wonder whether the noble Lord recognises that if he had not spoken at such length we could have pr...
Lord Howarth of Newport | 726 c227-30 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, this has been a better debate than it looked like being. We were not exactly playing to a ...
Lord Howarth of Newport | 726 c230 (Link to this contribution) I assure the noble Lord that that is absolutely not the case. We have had a useful exploratory deba...
Lord Howarth of Newport | 726 c160 (Link to this contribution) The noble Lord, Lord Rennard, makes an excellent point. However, I am optimistic because we are abou...
Lord Howarth of Newport | 726 c159-60 (Link to this contribution) I wonder if I may be permitted to make a general point, briefly, as we move into Committee, before I...
Lord Rennard | 726 c160 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, very briefly, I say that the noble Lord did perhaps invite us to slumber on a number of oc...
Lord Howarth of Newport | 726 c159 (Link to this contribution) 1: Clause 1, page 1, line 4, leave out subsection (2) and insert— ““( ) The polling days for the nex...
Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 726 c191-2 (Link to this contribution) He has actually put it to Parliament for it to support. Parliament will have had to vote that throug...
Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 726 c191 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, we have once again had a spirited and interesting debate with a number of important points...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 726 c191 (Link to this contribution) It is because it is part of a series of measures of constitutional change. The noble Lord, Lord Tyle...
Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames | 726 c183-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I do not accept that. It is not the abolition of a House to change its composition, howeve...
Lord Cormack | 726 c183 (Link to this contribution) I am extremely grateful to the noble Lord, but when he read out the list of issues which could be su...
Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames | 726 c183 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble Baroness is perhaps addressing a debate that we are yet to have on another occas...
Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames | 726 c184-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble Baroness is absolutely right to draw attention to the fact that the Constitution...
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 726 c184 (Link to this contribution) My recollection is that the Constitution Committee took the view that there should have been pre-leg...
Lord Cormack | 726 c185 (Link to this contribution) It is nowhere near as high a threshold as has been put in this Bill for a dissolution of Parliament....
Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames | 726 c185 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, 66 per cent of the House of Commons voting on an occasion when we may expect a turnout of ...
Lord Grocott | 726 c185 (Link to this contribution) Did the noble Lord not say in the first part of his remarks that he was very much in favour of refer...
Baroness Hayter of Kentish Town | 726 c185-6 (Link to this contribution) I apologise to your Lordships for intervening at this stage when I was not here for Second Reading, ...
Earl of Onslow | 726 c188 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I crave your Lordships’ indulgence and apologise for not being able to speak at Second Rea...
Lord Pannick | 726 c188-9 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I, too, support the observations of the noble Lord, Lord Cormack, as to the need for caref...
Lord Brooke of Sutton Mandeville | 726 c189-90 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I realise that I regard the noble Baroness, Lady Hayter of Kentish Town, as an agreeable a...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 726 c190 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, that is an interesting contribution to follow. Like the noble Earl, Lord Onslow, I am plea...
Lord Tyler | 726 c190-1 (Link to this contribution) The noble Lord and I both served for many months on the working group chaired by his colleague, Mr J...
Lord Howarth of Newport | 726 c180-1 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am very happy to support the spirit of my noble friend Lord Grocott’s amendment. I have ...
Lord Grocott | 726 c179-80 (Link to this contribution) What a persuasive argument—I am completely convinced by that. If the Government are going to reduce...
Lord Grocott | 726 c179 (Link to this contribution) I thought that I might provoke someone.
Lord Maclennan of Rogart | 726 c179 (Link to this contribution) Does the noble Lord believe in the opposite proposition—that to give power to the electorate you sho...
Lord Grocott | 726 c179 (Link to this contribution) I do not know which of the various constitutional proposals increases the power of the electorate. T...
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 726 c179 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, between now and the next stage of this Bill I wonder if my noble friend could ponder wheth...
Lord Grocott | 726 c178 (Link to this contribution) I am interested but also worried because I care deeply about the outcome of the referendum and the d...
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 726 c183 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, can I just press the noble Lord further? As I understand it, the noble Lord’s party’s view...
Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames | 726 c183 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble Baroness’s logic is seductive and attractive, but it misses the point that, as a...
Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames | 726 c182 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble Earl is entirely right to say that the Bill is capable of extending a Parliament...
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 726 c182-3 (Link to this contribution) Can the noble Lord, Lord Marks, explain to me, because I listened to the logic he was developing, ho...
Earl of Onslow | 726 c182 (Link to this contribution) May I interrupt? Actually, it is a fundamental change. As the Bill is not subject to the 1911 Act, w...
Lord Howarth of Newport | 726 c182 (Link to this contribution) Does the noble Lord agree that this Bill marks a very significant step towards the creation of a wri...
Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames | 726 c182 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I do not accept that. It might indeed be desirable to have a written constitution, but tha...
Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames | 726 c181-2 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am one of those who is largely in favour of referendums for important constitutional ref...
Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 726 c173-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Howarth, and my noble friend Lord Rennard for introducing the...
Baroness Armstrong of Hill Top | 726 c174 (Link to this contribution) In the Local Government Bill in 1998, we made provision for significant pilots to take place on this...
Lord Grocott | 726 c171 (Link to this contribution) That rather proves my point. I like the simplicity of polling day being polling day. We all know the...
Lord Newton of Braintree | 726 c171-2 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, it is more or less fatal for me to come into the House because somebody always presses a b...
Baroness Golding | 726 c172 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I was an election agent for some 15 years, so I do not think that there is very much that ...
Lord Pannick | 726 c172 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Rennard, in answer to my intervention, accepted that if there is to b...
Lord Newton of Braintree | 726 c172 (Link to this contribution) The noble Lord refers to certain instances, including a terrorist attack. Such an event could occur ...
Lord Pannick | 726 c172 (Link to this contribution) The noble Lord is of course correct, but it is much less likely that the electorate who vote during ...
Earl of Onslow | 726 c178 (Link to this contribution) As the leader of the Labour Party has been discouraging the Deputy Prime Minister from taking any pa...
Lord Cormack | 726 c178 (Link to this contribution) The answer is simple: the Government knew that they could not get AV through the House of Commons. T...
Lord Grocott | 726 c178 (Link to this contribution) I hope that the wider electorate reach a sensible conclusion. We shall know soon enough.
Lord Howarth of Newport | 726 c175-7 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, this has been a lively debate with contributions from noble Lords all around the House spe...
Baroness Pitkeathley | 726 c177 (Link to this contribution) As we come to Amendment 3, I remind your Lordships that if it should be agreed to I cannot call Amen...
Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 726 c174-5 (Link to this contribution) The noble Baroness is encouraging me to look at these pilots. However, I seem to recall that voting ...
Lord Grocott | 726 c177-8 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I start by apologising to the Committee because my amendment includes the dreaded word ““r...
Lord Grocott | 726 c177 (Link to this contribution) 3: Clause 1, page 1, line 5, leave out ““is to be 7 May 2015”” and insert ““will be determined by a ...
Lord Rennard | 726 c165 (Link to this contribution) The noble Lord, Lord Pannick, makes a very good point, which I made when we discussed the issue in g...
Lady Saltoun of Abernethy | 726 c165 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I do not know but I would not be at all surprised if it turned out that people much prefer...
Lord Pannick | 726 c165 (Link to this contribution) Before the noble Lord sits down, does he accept that to mandate Saturday as the exclusive day for vo...
Lord Howarth of Newport | 726 c166 (Link to this contribution) Since we had our earlier exchange on this subject, I have been reminded that participation is actual...
Lord Cormack | 726 c166 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble Lords, Lord Howarth and Lord Rennard, have performed a very real service to the ...
Lord Rennard | 726 c165 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, few football matches last for nine hours on a Saturday and nine hours on a Sunday. I think...
Lord Tyler | 726 c168-9 (Link to this contribution) I am very glad that the noble Lord, Lord Bach, preceded me because it gives me an opportunity to con...
Lord Bach | 726 c167-8 (Link to this contribution) I understand what the noble Lord has said. He mentioned the magic date of 1 October 2013. My advice ...
Lord Rennard | 726 c167 (Link to this contribution) For clarification, I was not necessarily suggesting that this Bill should determine the issue but th...
Lord Bach | 726 c167 (Link to this contribution) I hope that the Committee will forgive me if I speak from the opposition Front Bench at this stage. ...
Lord Cormack | 726 c166-7 (Link to this contribution) I obviously listened carefully to what the noble Lord said, but there have been some disturbing acco...
Lord Rennard | 726 c170 (Link to this contribution) One of the attractions of voting on a Saturday and a Sunday, between the hours of, say, 9 am and 6 p...
Lord Grocott | 726 c169-70 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I echo what my noble friend Lord Howarth has said about how much better debates on major c...
Lord Howarth of Newport | 726 c160-1 (Link to this contribution) On the contrary, I myself went to sleep, but not during my own speeches—although I might have done, ...
Lord Tyler | 726 c160 (Link to this contribution) The noble Lord referred to slumbering Members on this side of the House. There is photographic evide...
Lord Rennard | 726 c163-4 (Link to this contribution) I support Amendment 2 and the amendments in my name and the names of my noble friends Lord Marks and...
Lord Howarth of Newport | 726 c161-3 (Link to this contribution) The noble Lord, Lord Cormack, raises an important point. It was the more remarkable that there shoul...
Lord Cormack | 726 c161 (Link to this contribution) Would the noble Lord recollect that in the election of 1974 there were very few postal votes cast? P...
Lord Rennard | 726 c164-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I anticipated that it would not be long before the noble Lord, Lord Grocott, found an oppo...
Lord Grocott | 726 c164 (Link to this contribution) I know that the noble Lord favours different electoral systems and is passionate about increased par...
Lord Grocott | 726 c197 (Link to this contribution) Doolally was the word. It is a splendid parliamentary term and I would not disagree with it. There ...
Lord Marks of Henley-on-Thames | 726 c185 (Link to this contribution) I qualified that by saying, ““on important matters of constitutional reform””, and I then went on to...
Lord Cormack | 726 c186-8 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, when I was first elected to the other place, I was a very staunch believer in parliamentar...
Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 726 c194 (Link to this contribution) The Minister is very careful in his choice of words. Can he assist me? What should I say in the refe...
Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 726 c201-3 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank my noble friend Lord Cormack and the noble Lord, Lord Howarth, for tabling the ame...
Subjects
Absent voting Devolution Elections Legislatures Fixed-term parliaments Dissolution Northern Ireland Referendums Parliament Scotland Voting behaviour Religion Wales
Legislation
Fixed-term Parliaments Bill 2010-12
Link
View this Parliamentary proceeding on www.publications.parliament.uk