New clause 50 debated and negatived on division (4 to 9). New clause 51 debated and withdrawn. New clause 52 negatived on division (1 to 9). New clause 56 negatived on division (1 to 9). New clause 57, discussed with new clauses 58 and 104, debated and withdrawn. New clause 66 debated and negatived on division (4 to 8). New clause 72 debated and negatived on division (2 to 9). New clause 76 negatived on division (1 to 13). New clause 77 debated and withdrawn. New clause 81, discussed with new clause 82, debated and negatived on division (4 to 9). New clause 82 negatived on division (4 to 9). New clause 83 debated and negatived on division (4 to 10). New clause 84 negatived on division (5 to 9). New clause 85, discussed with new clause 98, debated and negatived on division (5 to 9). New clause 86 debated and negatived on division (4 to 9). New clause 87, discussed with new clause 113, debated and negatived on division (5 to 9). New clause 96, discussed with new clause 97, debated and withdrawn. New clause 97 negatived on division (5 to 9). New clause 98 negatived on division (5 to 9). New clause 99 debated and negatived on division (4 to 9). New clause 101 debated and negatived on division (4 to 9). New clause 104 negatived on division (5 to 9). New clause 105, discussed with new clause 106, debated and negatived on division (4 to 9). New clause 106 negatived on division (4 to 9). New clause 108, discussed with new clause 109, debated and withdrawn. New clause 109 negatived on division (5 to 9). New clause 112, discussed with new clauses 110 and 111, debated and negatived on division (4 to 9). New schedule 1 agreed to. Clauses 68 and 69 agreed to. Clause 70, as amended, agreed to. Amendment 37 to clause 71 negatived on division (4 to 9). Amendment 38 to clause 71 negatived on division (4 to 9). Amendment 39 to clause 71 negatived on division (5 to 9). Clause 71, as amended, agreed to. Clause 72 agreed to. Bill, as amended, to be reported (Bill 131). Written evidence reported to the House.

New clause 50 debated and negatived on division (4 to 9). New clause 51 debated and withdrawn. New clause 52 negatived on division (1 to 9). New clause 56 negatived on division (1 to 9). New clause 57, discussed with new clauses 58 and 104, debated and withdrawn. New clause...

Lords committee stage sixth day. Clauses 39 to 53 agreed to. Bill reported without amendment.

Lords committee stage sixth day. Clauses 39 to 53 agreed to. Bill reported without amendment.

My Lords, our amendments in this group concern the future of the bank ring-fencing regime. I will start by setting out clearly the position that we have reached as the Official Opposition. Through our diagnostic work, we have found a consensus that the bank ring-fencing regime is no longer fit...

My Lords, our amendments in this group concern the future of the bank ring-fencing regime. I will start by setting out clearly the position that we have reached as the Official Opposition. Through our diagnostic work, we have found a consensus that the bank ring-fencing regime is no longer fit...

My Lords, if I may respond to that, I had thought until recently that what we were debating was a response to the Skeoch commission established by the last Government, but we have new amendments now, it seems—Amendment 160A and the abandonment of clauses—that are really throwing ring-fencing out. I...

My Lords, if I may respond to that, I had thought until recently that what we were debating was a response to the Skeoch commission established by the last Government, but we have new amendments now, it seems—Amendment 160A and the abandonment of clauses—that are really throwing ring-fencing out. I...

In Committee, it is normal to address the amendments and not opposition parties’ policy documents.

In Committee, it is normal to address the amendments and not opposition parties’ policy documents.

The amendment has been put to us at the last minute. The points that it relates to have been there for weeks, indeed months, but I would argue that what has triggered the amendment is the speech by the leader of the Conservative Party and the policy document that underpins...

The amendment has been put to us at the last minute. The points that it relates to have been there for weeks, indeed months, but I would argue that what has triggered the amendment is the speech by the leader of the Conservative Party and the policy document that underpins...

I rise to speak to the Motion that Clause 40 does not stand part. As I explained at Second Reading, I have no professional knowledge of the banking industry but, because of circumstances, for more than 14 years I have been in this Room talking about the finance industry and...

I rise to speak to the Motion that Clause 40 does not stand part. As I explained at Second Reading, I have no professional knowledge of the banking industry but, because of circumstances, for more than 14 years I have been in this Room talking about the finance industry and...

I support Amendment 160A. I want to start by briefly addressing a couple of issues raised by the noble Lord, Lord Pitt-Watson. Most importantly, I want briefly to quote the conclusions of the Skeoch report. The panel judges that the ring-fence

“is worth retaining at present”

but adds a number of considerations:

“The...

I support Amendment 160A. I want to start by briefly addressing a couple of issues raised by the noble Lord, Lord Pitt-Watson. Most importantly, I want briefly to quote the conclusions of the Skeoch report. The panel judges that the ring-fence

“is worth retaining at present”

but adds a number of considerations:

“The...

I did indeed talk to senior members of the Skeoch commission before writing my speech, and what I said is completely consistent with the conclusions of the Skeoch commission, which was set up by the previous Conservative Government, as I said.

I did indeed talk to senior members of the Skeoch commission before writing my speech, and what I said is completely consistent with the conclusions of the Skeoch commission, which was set up by the previous Conservative Government, as I said.

I am just reading the conclusions from the report, my Lords. They make it very clear that the continuation of ring-fencing made sense at the time the report was written, but the commission clearly envisaged that it might not be needed over the passage of time. I also remind noble...

I am just reading the conclusions from the report, my Lords. They make it very clear that the continuation of ring-fencing made sense at the time the report was written, but the commission clearly envisaged that it might not be needed over the passage of time. I also remind noble...

I find it difficult to believe that someone has told me that the withdrawal of Glass-Steagall, which took place 13 years before the global financial crisis, had no detriment to the American banking system. As I say, I have read the Skeoch report and discussed it with senior members of...

I find it difficult to believe that someone has told me that the withdrawal of Glass-Steagall, which took place 13 years before the global financial crisis, had no detriment to the American banking system. As I say, I have read the Skeoch report and discussed it with senior members of...

I also draw attention to the abolition of FOS, which the noble Lord mentioned. I draw the Committee’s attention to Amendment 172A, which discusses the changes proposed to FOS. It is to be abolished and replaced with something called the financial adjudication service, which is a broadly similar methodology to...

I also draw attention to the abolition of FOS, which the noble Lord mentioned. I draw the Committee’s attention to Amendment 172A, which discusses the changes proposed to FOS. It is to be abolished and replaced with something called the financial adjudication service, which is a broadly similar methodology to...

My Lords, I have some experience of ring-fencing as, in my capacity as the chairman of the risk committee of a major bank, I oversaw the implementation of ring-fencing. At that time, it was a significant risk to the bank that we would not be in compliance with the ring-fencing...

My Lords, I have some experience of ring-fencing as, in my capacity as the chairman of the risk committee of a major bank, I oversaw the implementation of ring-fencing. At that time, it was a significant risk to the bank that we would not be in compliance with the ring-fencing...

There were two points, one of which is that the Skeoch report says that the numbers given are not its numbers. The report is clear that whatever the cost of ring-fencing, it is not a cost to the economy—this is what the Vickers report said earlier

—and that, by removing...

There were two points, one of which is that the Skeoch report says that the numbers given are not its numbers. The report is clear that whatever the cost of ring-fencing, it is not a cost to the economy—this is what the Vickers report said earlier

—and that, by removing...

My Lords, I understand the point that the noble Lord is trying to make, but I argue that the risk of the taxpayer picking up the tab is now considerably lower, which means that it is reasonable to re-examine whether ring-fencing should be an ongoing part of the regime.

I was...

My Lords, I understand the point that the noble Lord is trying to make, but I argue that the risk of the taxpayer picking up the tab is now considerably lower, which means that it is reasonable to re-examine whether ring-fencing should be an ongoing part of the regime.

I was...

My Lords, it has been an unusual experience to have had a debate with two sides to it on the Bill; the Minister must be pleased about that. I am afraid that I sit firmly on the fence—indeed, on the ring-fence. I am in two minds on this issue. Ring-fencing...

My Lords, it has been an unusual experience to have had a debate with two sides to it on the Bill; the Minister must be pleased about that. I am afraid that I sit firmly on the fence—indeed, on the ring-fence. I am in two minds on this issue. Ring-fencing...

My Lords, I am delighted to have the debate, and I am very grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Pitt-Watson, for raising questions which have encouraged debate, but I support my noble friend Lady Neville-Rolfe’s opposition to Clause 39 standing part of the Bill. I also support her Amendment 160A...

My Lords, I am delighted to have the debate, and I am very grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Pitt-Watson, for raising questions which have encouraged debate, but I support my noble friend Lady Neville-Rolfe’s opposition to Clause 39 standing part of the Bill. I also support her Amendment 160A...

I wonder whether there might be some confusion here. The thing about the ring-fence is that there are activities within it that the Government are promising to bail out. Those things are being insured. By the way, the move in the ring-fence proposed by the Government will extend these a...

I wonder whether there might be some confusion here. The thing about the ring-fence is that there are activities within it that the Government are promising to bail out. Those things are being insured. By the way, the move in the ring-fence proposed by the Government will extend these a...

I thank the noble Lord, but it is about where the line is drawn in law, so that businesses can be certain and have predictability, because activities change day by day.

I thank the noble Lord, but it is about where the line is drawn in law, so that businesses can be certain and have predictability, because activities change day by day.