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Safeguarding Vulnerable Groups Bill [HL]

I am most grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Harris of Haringey, for speaking to the amendment, not least because of his vast experience in this field, but because I may have to be absent at later stages of the Bill. As the noble Lord, Lord Harris, said, at Second Reading several noble Lords expressed a wish to see one list that would cover both children and vulnerable adults. Like the noble Lord, I understand that that may not be possible. However, if the amendment moved by my noble friend Lord Rix is accepted, as the noble Lord, Lord Harris, has said, this amendment will not be moved. This amendment could be thought of as something like a ““next best”” to having one list. The amendment seeks to make clear in the Bill that there will be a presumption that inclusion in one list will lead to inclusion in the other list, unless it can be shown that such a step would be unreasonable. In other words, the person concerned would be able to challenge inclusion in both lists and, if good cause could be shown, the decision could be made to exclude that person from one of the lists. But, as the noble Lord, Lord Harris, indicated, the important point is that the issues would have been aired, an assessment of risk would have been made and the reasons for the decision would have been recorded. I am sure that the Committee will agree that the worst thing that could happen would be if someone who was, for example, barred from working with children became employed as a night-care assistant in a hostel for people with learning disabilities, or people who are deaf, blind or vulnerable in other ways. If that person was subsequently convicted of an offence of a similar kind, I feel sure that the court would not understand, the parents would not understand, and the public would certainly not understand, how that could have been allowed to happen. Both my noble friend Lord Rix and the noble Lord, Lord Harris of Haringey, referred to the research by the Ann Craft Trust. I am sure that Members of the Committee will appreciate the significance of that research in highlighting the fact that abuse can occur across a wide age range and that it is not just about sex but also about power, whatever the age of the person. Therefore, we think that it is very important that the Bill should make plain that there is a presumption that somebody barred from working with one set of vulnerable adults should also be barred from working with other vulnerable groups unless good reason can be shown why that should not happen.