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House of Lords Bill [HL]

My Lords, it is a pleasure to follow the noble Earl. We are indeed fortunate to have him here and to have the benefit of his wise words, with which I entirely agree. When the matter was debated in the summer, it was stressed that the Bill ought to be one that everyone could support, regardless of their views on the future composition of the House. If we are to get consensus, we ought to be able to achieve consensus on this Bill. I have therefore been somewhat disappointed by some of the speeches made against it, which I believe are wrong. In particular, the noble Lord, Lord Richard, seems to suppose that it in some way pre-empts what happens eventually. That is not the case. It improves the situation between now and when, if ever, that decision is eventually taken. It is important and urgent that we make the changes proposed by the noble Lord. Lord Steel. A great deal of damage has been done to this House by the cash for peerages scandal. Therefore it is important that we change from the present appointment system to one that is clearly impartial and not subject to undue outside pressures. I am sorry that the noble Lord, Lord Richard, is not in his place, but he is wrong to say that this ought not to be done now; it should be done now. The case for that is overwhelming. This is a modernising Bill. My right honourable friend the leader of the Opposition, Mr Cameron, says that he is in favour of modernisation. This is a modernising Bill. It moves us forward in the right direction, regardless of what eventual decision is made on composition. There is an excellent Library note on the Weatherill amendment. It depicts the dramatic events in 1999. It was supposed to be a temporary arrangement that ensured that stage 2 took place. We could not have clearer evidence that it has failed in that objective. At the same time, it has created a certain number of problems. I stress one particular point. Lord Weatherill himself introduced a Bill in 2003 to get rid of the system with which his name had been associated. The other important point is that, as far as I am aware, there is no reason why the hereditary Peers who were removed from the House in 1999 could not have been made life Peers to allow them to re-enter the House. It is essential to get the Bill on the statute book as early as possible. It has been suggested that long-term reform, in the sense of composition, may be many years ahead. We do not want to go on meanwhile with the present appointment system unimproved—in particular, with the problem of non-attendance of Members and the fact that the House is getting larger and larger. The Bill proposed by the noble Lord, Lord Steel, seeks to deal with that point, which is very important. I make two final points. First, it has been suggested that we must take account of the vote in the House of Commons. We must certainly take account of it, but it was advertised—if I may put it that way—as an indicative vote. I believe that opinion in the other place on the issue of composition is changing. Gradually, Members in the other place are beginning to appreciate the radical changes that have taken place in this House since 1999, which have vastly improved the way in which it operates. As that opinion changes, over time—I hope that the White Paper will take account of this—before the eventual decision on change of composition, we will get a greatly better situation. Secondly, the vote for 100 per cent in the other place was flawed in various respects by tactical voting. If the proposal were indeed to have a 100 per cent elected House—effectively abolishing this House as it now is—we have at some stage to question whether the basis on which constitutional change takes place in this country is really as it should be. I do not go for a referendum, because ignorance of the work of the House of Lords in the country as a whole, despite the efforts of the Lord Speaker, is probably almost as great as that in another place. I am mindful of Ted Heath’s remark that a majority of one is enough, but we must consider whether a larger majority may be more appropriate if we are going to undertake a fundamental constitutional revolution.