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Child Maintenance and Other Payments Bill

My Lords, I have felt more and more superfluous as I have listened to this debate, because of the level of expertise and command of certain Members of this House. I say to my noble friend Lord Kirkwood, that if the board are foolish enough to reject him from that role, that would be our loss. Someone with that degree of expertise is required. As the noble Baroness, Lady Hollis, went through the levels of complication required in this area, I wondered whether she was constructing a maze or spider's web of difficulty for people to fall into. Her grasp of the realities of the social concepts were obvious. Anyone who has had anything to do with the CSA will recognise this. My first connection was when I received what in parliamentary slang are called green ink letters relating to the CSA addressed to me. I remember one individual who was convinced that the CSA was out to get him because it was run by Freemasons. That was the primary objective. How he had so offended Freemasons never become clear. But the CSA has not worked. It has been heavy-handed. As has been said, it has become an excuse for non-compliance. We have devalued the currency of legislation and government action. Indeed, we should have all stood around and welcomed a Bill that simply got rid of the name. That would have been a step forward. We have created something that does not work. The Government are effectively putting their hands up and saying that we have got to get on and do something else. Congratulations to them for that. Those who tried were always well intentioned. I remember that my right honourable friend Charles Kennedy was once asked which vote he most regretted having cast. He said that the vote he most regretted not having cast was against the creation of the CSA. It sounded a good idea—to do something, get behind it and go forward. However, the fact of the matter is that it has failed and has created resentment. Thus, any step forward may almost have negative implications. Then we encouraged the voluntary agreements. As I read it, the Government’s main intention is that the freed-up man hours gained from this will enable us to deal more efficiently with the new system or adaptation to make sure that maintenance is paid via enforcement. As the noble Baroness, Lady Hollis, pointed out, those who will take advantage of this are probably those who will be the best payers anyway and those who have most to lose from court action. Those who simply abscond will probably not be affected. Those who have the most complicated and messy social and family backgrounds will not pay. There is our problem. When we go through the Bill in Committee and on Report, can we get a structure together which will enable us to deliver better? Nothing else really can be said on that, but that is what we are confronted with here. Computer systems are beyond us. Indeed, many of the systems on my own computer are beyond me. We must try to get an administrative structure, guidance and a will to help. Everybody wishes this measure well because it is not something for which any politician can take great credit. We have got to make sure we can get the detail right. I will not go into the detail now because others have done so more eloquently than I and because I have discovered that the list of details is so long that I would never finish. However, the attitude which I mentioned must be carried forward into Committee. If it is, we may plug holes and do so with experience—we can refer back to previous experience on this of a similar system that failed. On mesothelioma— all day I have been dreading pronouncing that; have I got it right?