---

Criminal Evidence (Witness Anonymity) Bill

I was just about to turn to the noble and learned Lord. Although he was not able to speak at Second Reading, his intervention here is none the less extremely welcome, even though he is arguing against the point that I am making. I hope that he did not mind our reading the short extract from his letter at Second Reading, but we could not find him to ask whether he would find that acceptable. I am glad that he does not seem to object. I acknowledge that the issues raised by noble Lords here today are very real and valid, although the Government believe that, none the less, there is a strong case to allow magistrates’ courts to be able to make decisions in relation to witness anonymity orders. We all agree that this needs further consideration. I am certainly prepared to examine the issue in more detail over the coming months, to consult noble Lords and to reach a considered view on the appropriate way forward in time for the fourth Session Bill. There is no argument that this matter requires further consideration; the question is whether, in the light of that, we retain the Bill as it is or agree to the amendment moved by the noble Lord, Lord Thomas, and exclude magistrates’ courts in the short interim period. My argument for suggesting that the Committee does not go down that path is that essentially we have sought, in the construction of this Bill, to take things as they are—the status quo—and to ensure, as the noble and learned Lord, Lord Lloyd, rightly suggested, that we have the safeguards necessary to ensure that this complies with ECHR considerations. On that basis I argue that, as this vision of witness anonymity has applied to magistrates’ courts in the past, we would be sensible to allow that to continue in the interim. None the less, I accept that we then need to have a serious discussion on the future with noble Lords and other interested parties in time for the arrival of the substantive Bill before your Lordships’ House.