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Knife Crime

Perhaps the hon. Gentleman would be right if people were able to keep order on such schemes, but they are not. People never will be able to do that, because of all the human rights legislation and so on. When we talk to people who run those schemes, we hear about those who do not want to do community service because it is raining and they will get wet, and those who do not want to wear their orange tabards because they feel that it is against their human rights. There is no one in the probation service who is prepared to lay down the law and say, "You will go out there and do this; otherwise you're going straight back to prison." When we talk to those young people, we find that they do not want to go to prison. Prison is seen as much worse than community sentences. Defence barristers never say, "M'lud, please don't give him a community sentence, it'll be far too tough—please send my client to prison instead." When defence briefs start making such pleas, I will start believing that community sentences are a worthwhile deterrent. Earlier, the hon. Gentleman said that catching people was the best incentive. One reason for the police's inability to catch people is that the criminals are all out on the streets. If we took some of the worst ones off the streets and kept them in prison for a while, the police could start concentrating on the rest. Resources are currently spread too thinly.