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Debate on bill on Wednesday, 10 October 2007, in the House of Lords.

Local Government and Public Involvement in Health Bill

Local Government and Public Involvement in Health Bill. Lords report stage second day. Amendment 79A agreed to on division (183 votes to 140). Amendment 146 disagreed to on division (38 votes to 113). Part 1 of 2 records.

Secondary information

Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
695 c242-300 
Session
2006-07
Legislative stage
Report stage
Procedure
New clauses
Chamber / Committee
House of Lords chamber
Related items
Proceeding contributions
Lord Greaves | 695 c253-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble Lord is completely wrong in his reading of the Bill. If it is enacted in its pre...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c254-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, Amendment No. 79 raises the same issue as has been raised by my noble friend Lord Greaves;...
Show all contributions (101)
Lord Greaves | 695 c250-3 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 78: 78: Clause 62, page 34, line 36, leave out ““by the executive leader”” and...
Lord Graham of Edmonton | 695 c253 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am interested in the genesis of the amendment. I am aware of leaders of the majority par...
Baroness Morgan of Drefelin | 695 c249 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I remind the House that this is the Report stage and noble Lords do not normally speak aft...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c249-50 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am most grateful to the noble Baroness. For about half my adult life I have been involve...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c249 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, that is not how I read the amendments. To reiterate the case, the leadership models offere...
Lord Smith of Leigh | 695 c249 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, before the noble Baroness, Lady Scott of Needham Market, responds, how does my noble frien...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c246-9 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, we indeed debated much of this in Committee at great length and with some passion, and we ...
Baroness Hamwee | 695 c249 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, does the Minister accept that she has made my noble friend’s case extremely well? She advo...
Baroness Hanham | 695 c245 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, we had a long debate on this in Committee and I just want to reiterate that our views acco...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c242 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I beg to move that the Bill be now further considered on Report. Moved accordingly, and, ...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c242 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 69: 69: Clause 54, page 27, line 27, leave out ““(1)(a)”” and insert ““(1)”” ...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c243 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendments Nos. 71 to 76: 71: Clause 59, page 31, line 21, at end insert— ““(1A) A local aut...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c243-5 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 77: 77: Clause 62, page 34, line 23, leave out subsections (2) and (3) The no...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c258 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have to say that I do not know. It seems to me that every council in the country might h...
Lord Greaves | 695 c258-60 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank everyone who has taken part and the Minister for her response. I would never descr...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c260-1 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 79A: 79A: Clause 62, page 35, line 7, leave out subsection (6) The noble Baro...
Baroness Hanham | 695 c261-2 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have tabled a whole raft of amendments in this group—Amendments Nos. 102, 104 to 106, 10...
Baroness Maddock | 695 c262-3 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I support my noble friend on the Front Bench. When somebody explained to me what was going...
Lord Greaves | 695 c263 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have a brief point to add to the excellent speeches of my noble friend Lady Scott and th...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c263 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I can see that nothing much has changed over the summer despite meetings and letters, and ...
Baroness Hanham | 695 c255 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have been in almost total agreement with my noble friends on the Liberal Democrat Benche...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c255-8 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to both noble Baronesses for their comments and to the noble Lord, Lord Grea...
Lord Greaves | 695 c258 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I understand a great deal of what the noble Baroness said and I understand that in practic...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c269 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I believe that it is perfectly possible to proceed with these government amendments. If ne...
Baroness Hanham | 695 c269 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, we have an intriguing situation here. The Minister has just lost the clause. As I understa...
Baroness Hanham | 695 c269-70 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, another point has just occurred to me which I do not think that we cleared in Committee. T...
Baroness Hamwee | 695 c269 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for responding to the points that I made the other day on Am...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c268 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 87: 87: Clause 64, page 37, leave out lines 5 to 7 The noble Baroness said: M...
Lord Greaves | 695 c273 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I think that when the Minister reads what she has said she will realise that she was diggi...
Lord Greaves | 695 c270-1 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 89: 89: Clause 64, page 37, line 21, after ““proposals”” insert— ““(a)”” The ...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c270 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, they are indeed supernumerary. They are extra to the number of councillors. On Question, ...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c272-3 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, we have a new word in the great British lexicon: ““in-touchedness””. It is charming and we...
Lord Graham of Edmonton | 695 c271 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I stand not as an opponent to the weapon of a referendum but as someone who wants it to be...
Baroness Hanham | 695 c264 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, before the Minister sits down, will she confirm that those who will be standing for this s...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c264 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, that is true. I ask the noble Baronesses opposite whether they really want to remove choi...
Baroness Maddock | 695 c263 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank the noble Baroness for giving way. So the decision cannot be made before the Bill ...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c268 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 82: 82: Clause 63, page 36, leave out line 16 On Question, amendment agreed t...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c265 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Baroness for her comments, but I just want to make a few remark...
Baroness Hanham | 695 c265 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, but that could be their first experience of being councillors?
Baroness Andrews | 695 c264 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, they would stand as councillors as well as being on the slate.
Baroness Hanham | 695 c264 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, so they need have no experience of operating in a council?
Baroness Andrews | 695 c281 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 117: 117: Clause 66, page 43, line 14, at end insert— ““( ) For subsection (5)...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c281 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 118: 118: Clause 67, page 43, leave out lines 30 to 33 and insert— ““(2) A ref...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c277 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 103: 103: Clause 64, page 41, leave out lines 23 to 33 The noble Baroness sai...
Viscount Ullswater | 695 c277 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I must advise your Lordships that if the amendment is agreed to I will be unable to call A...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c278 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am happy to respond to the noble Baroness’s invitation because we did have exchanges dur...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c278 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful for that clarification and I beg leave to withdraw the amendment. Amendment...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c278 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendments Nos. 110 to 113: 110: Clause 64, page 42, line 16, leave out ““1 October”” and in...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c279-80 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Baroness for explaining why she is concerned and how her amendm...
Baroness Hamwee | 695 c276-7 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the persuasion and the withdrawal are not necessarily cause and effect. I was slightly thr...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c277 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendments Nos. 96 to 101: 96: Clause 64, page 40, line 8, after ““meeting”” insert ““ which...
Baroness Hamwee | 695 c274-5 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 94: 94: Clause 64, page 38, line 43, leave out ““the end of the permitted reso...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c275-6 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I do not see the provision of resolution periods as a draconian attempt to impose central ...
Lord Graham of Edmonton | 695 c273 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, it is not just that, broadly, every four years we have a general election—which of course ...
Lord Greaves | 695 c273-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, in our area people vote every year locally, and long may we continue to do so. I say ““we”...
Lord Greaves | 695 c274 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, my number is up. I do not understand these things. I think that there are buttons on it th...
Lord Greaves | 695 c274 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I do not think that it is mine. If it is, it has come on by itself.
Lord Greaves | 695 c292 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I ought to thank the Minister for the titbits that I have been thrown. Sometimes, when nob...
Lord Greaves | 695 c289 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, that is an offer that I cannot refuse. I will withdraw the amendment. I must tell the Mini...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c290 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 127: 127: Clause 71, leave out Clause 71 On Question, amendment agreed to. C...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c290 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 137: 137: Clause 80, leave out Clause 80 On Question, amendment agreed to. C...
Baroness Crawley | 695 c290-1 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 138: 138: Clause 81, page 55, line 2, at end insert— ““11B De-grouping: altern...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c287 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 124: 124: Clause 69, leave out Clause 69 On Question, amendment agreed to. C...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c287 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 125: 125: Clause 70, leave out Clause 70 On Question, amendment agreed to. C...
Lord Greaves | 695 c287-9 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 126: 126: Clause 71, page 46, line 34, leave out from beginning to end of line...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c289 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, it has been one of my lifetime’s ambitions to debate voting systems with the noble Lord, a...
Lord Greaves | 695 c293-4 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 145A: 145A: Clause 82, page 57, line 23, at end insert— ““( ) The appointment ...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c292-3 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendments Nos. 139 to 145: 139: Clause 81, page 55, line 25, at end insert— ““12B Groups of...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c286-7 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, this is a slightly surreal point given the circumstances. I am not entirely certain that I...
Baroness Hamwee | 695 c285 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, when the reference to a Maoist Government was made, I wrote down, ““Maoist—don’t shoot the...
Baroness Hamwee | 695 c285-6 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 121: 121: Clause 68, page 45, line 24, at end insert ““subject to removal from...
Lord Greaves | 695 c283-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I was not going to speak to the amendment but was encouraged to do so by the noble Lord, L...
Lord Smith of Leigh | 695 c282 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I do not understand this amendment as it seems to me that the size of the executive should...
Lord Graham of Edmonton | 695 c282-3 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, these are early days for the present system. It was a novelty. I have to tell your Lordshi...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c281 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 119: 119: Clause 67, leave out Clause 67 On Question, amendment agreed to.
Baroness Hamwee | 695 c281-2 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 120: 120: After Clause 67, insert the following new Clause— ““Membership of ma...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c287 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 123: 123: Clause 68, leave out Clause 68 On Question, amendment agreed to. C...
Lord Greaves | 695 c298 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, will the Government be monitoring the use of these powers, should they become law? If I we...
Baroness Hamwee | 695 c298 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I rise to give the noble Baroness a little more thinking time before she answers that ques...
Baroness Crawley | 695 c298 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have given an assurance to the noble Baroness, Lady Hamwee, that the full standards regi...
Baroness Crawley | 695 c297 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I may have to write to the noble Baroness about that. Obviously there is a rational reason...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c297 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, will the noble Baroness explain why such young people, with all they have to offer, could ...
Baroness Crawley | 695 c297-8 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, perhaps not for this Bill, but it is certainly another way of approaching the issue. While...
Lord Greaves | 695 c297 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the Minister has invited me to give her the results of my thoughts. If you want 16 and 17 ...
Lord Greaves | 695 c295 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am rather more pleased to withdraw this amendment than some of my previous amendments. O...
Baroness Crawley | 695 c295 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Greaves, for his amendments. I endorse his underlining of the...
Baroness Crawley | 695 c296-7 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I hope that I shall be able to give the noble Baroness, Lady Scott of Needham Market, the ...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c295-6 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 146: 146: Clause 82, leave out Clause 82 The noble Baroness said: My Lords, A...
Baroness Morgan of Drefelin | 695 c300 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I beg to move that further consideration on Report be now adjourned. In moving the Motion,...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c299 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble Baroness used the expression that the pass has already been sold and I took that...
Baroness Crawley | 695 c299 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I did not say that we just give up. I said we use this as an opportunity, given the realit...
Baroness Scott of Needham Market | 695 c299 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to noble Lords who have contributed to this short but important debate. The ...
Baroness Hamwee | 695 c280 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Baroness. I cannot remember whether Southwark did hold a refere...
Baroness Hamwee | 695 c287 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister. That was exactly the point: that resignation might be claim...
Baroness Andrews | 695 c284-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, we would no doubt say ““More’s the pity””. I have always wanted to belong to a Maoist rev...
Baroness Hamwee | 695 c279 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 115: 115: Clause 65, page 43, line 6, at end insert— ““( ) In section 35(1) of...
Subjects
Councillors Elections Local government Political parties Parish and town councils Local government executive
Legislation
Local Government and Public Involvement in Health Bill 2006-07
Link
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