---

Legislative and Regulatory Reform Bill

I support my noble friend's amendment. I speak with a very clear memory of having taken the financial resolution to the European Communities Bill, as it then was, through the House of Commons. It was an extremely unusual procedure because an entire day was given to debating the financial resolution in contra-distinction to the normal maximum of one and a half hours. In those days, I was a very firm supporter of British membership of the European Union, or the Common Market, as it was then called. I wrote an article, which was quoted in a number of places, called Integration or Isolation—the title speaks for itself. However, my experience since then has shown that that has altogether got out of control; it has gone too far. Although I do not for one moment go the whole way with the noble Lord, Lord Stoddart of Swindon, the amendment moved by my noble friend and the very measured terms in which he moved it are far short of the apocalyptic wishes of the noble Lord, Lord Stoddart of Swindon. My noble friend made three points. The first was that it is important that the British Parliament should assert what has been at the heart of our jurisprudence over centuries: the supremacy of Parliament. I could quote a number of statements by prominent jurists to make it clear that, as is always said, no Parliament can bind its successor and that the courts have an inalienable duty to apply the law as propounded by Parliament. I believe that we are in danger of allowing the 1972 Act somehow to become part of a constitution that cannot be amended by the British Parliament. My noble friend has stated that as his first reason for his amendment and I think he is right. His second reason was his clear assertion—here he is at one with Ministers—of the wish to avoid the charge of gold-plating. It seems to me that, in these circumstances, it is entirely right that when an order falls to be made to implement a European directive, it should be perfectly possible to implement it in a way that does not involve gold-plating. We have had a recent example of the European directive on the use of lead in manufacturing which immediately had all the organ builders in Britain up in arms. The Government then had to say, ““Oh, but it does not apply to organ builders””. They had no power to say that because the directive was completely sweeping. Would they not have preferred a procedure under which they could have said, ““We are going to interpret this order in this way””, and so it would not apply to the people who provide one of the glories of the Anglican Church and other Churches, the tradition of organ music? When my noble friend came to his third point, on which such emphasis was laid by the noble Lord, Lord Stoddart of Swindon, he was extremely careful to say that this would have to be only at the end of extremely careful diplomatic discussion. It could not simply be a question of kicking sand in the commissioners’ faces, but there would be a case in those circumstances for saying, ““Look, I am afraid we must ask for a derogation””. To secure that, they would need the power to implement the order differently from what the Commission had perhaps assumed. That does not seem to go against this country’s obligations, particularly under the 1972 Act, to the European Union in any way, but provides the Government with an avenue of escape. The noble Lord, Lord Goodhart, said it would clearly be controversial and entirely wrong to do it as an order under the Bill. But the point is that this Bill will be an Act, and the Government would clearly only do it if it had wide support in the country. They would say ““We are not going to do it as the Europeans apparently expect; we have negotiated that, it has been agreed, and we now have the power to do it differently””. In those circumstances, I see my noble friend’s amendment as restating an important principle—the sovereignty of Parliament—in a way that gives the Government avenues of escape, so that we can avoid some of the absurdities which have landed burdens on industry and others in the country. I have never been regarded as one of the ““usual suspects””, to quote again the noble Lord, Lord Stoddart. On the contrary, I have usually been regarded as a warm supporter of membership of the European Union, and have been so all along. There must be some flexibility, however. The ““magic words””, as they have been described in another place, in my noble friend’s amendment— "““notwithstanding the European Communities Act 1972””—" would bind the courts. They would have to have regard to a later Act passed by Parliament. My noble friend’s amendment is a careful, modestly worded proposal for something we could certainly accept.