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Charities Bill [Lords]

I begin by apologising to Members who expected my right hon. Friend the Member for Maidstone and The Weald (Miss Widdecombe) to speak to the amendment. I am sure that if she catches your eye, Mr. Deputy Speaker, she will have the opportunity to speak, but I acknowledge that many Members would have preferred that she do so now. There are two purposes only to the amendment, and both encompass the removal from the Bill of the presumption that the advancement of religion is a charitable activity. The first purpose, raised by some of my right hon. and hon. Friends, is to question whether the Charity Commission is willing or able to apply the right public benefit test to religions. The second is to ask whether it is possible for certain religions to pass that test. In Committee, we discussed three different activities in the same debate: education, the relief of poverty and the advancement of religion. Under the Bill, each of those activities loses the presumption of public benefit. It was accepted that the public benefit test varies from group to group. Despite the fact that all those activities have enjoyed the presumption of public benefit, some charities have none the less had to demonstrate public benefit, so public benefit tests vary from group to group. This debate will give us the opportunity to concentrate solely on religion. In Committee, I said:"““I am told that…it is not those who engage in religious practices who are the public who benefit; the public benefit is the benefit that they bring to society by rubbing shoulders with those who do not so engage…people who engage in religious practices are presumed to become more moral and altruistic as a result, so the public at large benefit when they mix with such people.””—[Official Report, Standing Committee A, 4 July 2006; c. 50.]" On Second Reading, however, the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster said that"““all charities will have to show that they are for the public benefit…an organisation will have to show that it generates identifiable benefits that reach…a sufficiently large section of the public.””—[Official Report, 26 June 2006; Vol. 448, c. 25.]" My concern is that some charities will find it very difficult to demonstrate that.