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Counter-Terrorism

I agree with some of the hon. Gentleman’s comments. I have long said that control orders are not even my second-best option. In many cases deportation would be the second-best option. Next to that, detention would be. Beyond that, full control orders and surveillance might be, so we get to the fourth option, which sometimes feels like trying to keep soup in a sieve. Then, ironically, people who are sometimes those who have most bitterly opposed the strengthening of my powers, point out how inadequate they are for controlling terrorist suspects. I agree with that. However, the conclusion that we would need to derogate from or abandon the principles enshrined in the European convention on human rights is not a right conclusion. We certainly need to appeal against one judgment in particular—the Chahal judgment, with which the hon. Gentleman will be very familiar—which was made by the European Court before we had a Human Rights Act in this country, and even before we had a Labour Government. I believe that that decision is very wrong, and we are appealing and doing everything we can to reverse it. We are appealing on the back of one case, and considering appealing on the back of a second case. There is a growing awareness throughout Europe that that decision and its implications are extremely serious, and that we need to try to ensure that we strengthen our European convention to take account of today’s threat—the intention and capability that was not envisaged when we brought in the European convention from the circumstances of the mid- 20th century. There are now individuals who have the potential capability of wreaking misery and death on a massive scale that 60 years ago was within the grasp of only a sovereign state. There are now individuals and networks of individuals who are capable of doing that, and we need to ensure that our powers are strong enough to encompass that challenge as well.