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Human Fertilisation and Embryology Bill [HL]

My Lords, I shall address myself to the question raised by the right reverend Prelate about crossing the boundary between human and animal species. The right reverend Prelate will have seen the discussion in Committee about the extent to which animal embryos mixed with human DNA are used. They have been used for a long time already, so that boundary, if treated generally, has already been crossed. The material in that area, if regulated at all, is regulated by the Animals (Scientific Procedures) Act. There is a question about whether embryos in that area are regulated at all because the Act refers to the embryo of an animal, but if an embryo has human material mixed with it, it may no longer be the embryo of that animal. If that is the case, it is not regulated as an embryo, although there is regulation if it were to be implanted in an animal. So that boundary was passed a long time ago and is why using the phrase ““interspecies embryo”” in the Bill was very easy to understand, except that it does not properly reflect what is being regulated as the Bill says that if you start with the human embryo and puts animal DNA in it, within limits, you should treat it with the same respect as you accord to a human embryo. In 1990, there was a considerable debate about whether human embryos should be used for research at all. The Government of that day gave a free vote on that matter to everyone who took their Whip. There was a free vote about it in this House. The House decided by quite a substantial majority to allow research on human embryos under specific conditions, including one that looks quite like what the noble Baroness, Lady Williams of Crosby, quoted from the noble Lord, Lord Hunt, speaking at that time, I think, for the Government as Minister for health. That clause is in the 1990 Act, and it is reproduced to a considerable extent in the present Bill. What is proposed by the Government and was supported by the Joint Committee, of which I am a member, is that if the human embryo is modified or admixed with animal DNA material, it should be accorded the respect as a embryo that is accorded to the human embryo by the 1990 Act, but with prohibitions that do not apply to the human embryo, generally speaking, under the 1990 Act; namely, that it is not to be allowed to exist for more than 14 days and is not to be implanted in a human being. The idea of the Bill is to take this extension of the human embryo and treat it for practical purposes of regulation in the same way as an ordinary human embryo would be treated with those additional restrictions. That is what it is about. If you do not believe that embryo research is right at all, that has a certain consequence. If you do believe that embryo research is right, subject to the conditions of the 1990 Act, you have the additional question of whether this admixture makes all the difference. Considering what has happened with animal embryos, to which I have referred and which was discussed in considerable detail in Committee, that problem may be resolved for you by the experience of what has happened already. The important thing is whether these admixed human embryos—I believe that is a more accurate expression: it may not be quite as simple as interspecies embryo but accuracy is sometimes better than simplicity in a situation such as this—should be permitted if there are benefits to be gained. The licence conditions require that, so a licence should not be granted unless the specified conditions are accepted. For my part, although I understand perfectly the arguments that the noble Lord, Lord Alton, and the right reverend Prelate have raised, in the present circumstances, I feel that it is right for Parliament to allow these matters to be considered for licensing. Of course, there is a very important question about the utility of the research, and so on, but that is for the licensing authority to consider on a particular application.