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Criminal Justice and Immigration Bill

My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Baroness and I welcome the opportunity to debate again the breach provisions, which we believe are necessary. One would hope that the YRO system is so successful that there are no breaches and that therefore it is not necessary to use the relevant provisions. However, we should not be naïve about that. Except in what we hope will be exceptional circumstances, officers will be able to use appropriate discretion when operating the breach system. Warning systems will be in place and are designed to ensure that a breach is dealt with at an early stage without the consequences that the noble Baroness mentioned. She is concerned that the measure will lead to a lot of breaches, which will result in more young people ending up eventually in custody. I understand those concerns. However, I have noticed in my visits around the country that on the other side of the fence, if you like, community sentences can be seen as a soft option. They have not been viewed as a vigorous option and some believed that breaches were not pursued as effectively as possible. That view is changing but it is very important to have effective breach mechanisms to ensure that what we are seeking to do retains its credibility. I am clear that the general thrust of youth justice in the Bill has received a lot of support from noble Lords. I am in no doubt about that whatever. The breach provisions ensure that there are appropriate sanctions if young people do not fulfil the terms of the orders.