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Human Fertilisation and Embryology Bill [HL]

My Lords, they may not be sinister, but they are startling. That is what gives point to our deliberation this evening. It has been and is being a fascinating debate because it has a sort of hybrid character, with little Second Reading paragraphs coming in and Committee points being raised. Then we have the whole question of the constitutional procedure, on which I shall add a word to what my noble friend Lord Waddington said. As a second Chamber with a watching brief on constitution and procedure, we must be aware of what is happening in the other place, even if we are not entitled to express our opinion to it. What has happened in the other place colours our reception of what arrives here from there. A large and, for laymen—such as most of us on this matter—complex series of paragraphs has been introduced which has elicited speeches, such as that of my noble and learned friend Lord Mackay of Clashfern, crying out for a discussion in Committee. I would like to ask questions about our friends ““C”” and ““P”” in particular, who have very chequered histories through the paragraphs in Amendment No. 92; they are ill in all sorts of ways, incapacitated in others and finally dead, but still contributing to the human species. All of them give their human, although not their other, selves, I see. One could make those points in Committee, but not in a debate like this. I regret that we are being asked to deal with these fundamental, important and complex matters through a procedure that does not allow one, as I have been reminded this evening, to speak after the Minister as one can in Committee. Most of one’s real questions bubble up following what the Minister has said in reply. If the reply is inadequate, one cannot say so. One cannot test it. It is there, then followed by a whipped vote and the matter is closed. I ask your Lordships to support my noble friend not only for the merits of the amendments under consideration, but for the important procedural points that accompany them.