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Local Government (Devon, Norfolk and Suffolk)

This has been a lively and occasionally passionate debate, with feelings running high in all parts of the House. Feelings are running equally high on the ground in Exeter and Devon, in Norwich and Norfolk, and in Suffolk. The proposals have a Marmite-like quality: people either love them or hate them. Tonight we have heard a great deal from those who "hate that black fudge kind of stuff." We have heard some thoughtful contributions, but most have completely ignored the fact that the proposals have had huge cross-party support in both Norwich and Exeter. People in those proud and ancient cities want, and have wanted for almost half a century, the right to control their own affairs. These proposals are localism carried to its logical conclusion, and I am sorry that Opposition Members cannot see that. Many seem to feel that there is an element of force in the proposals. The hon. Member for North Cornwall (Dan Rogerson) referred to their being rammed through, thus completely ignoring the fact that the boundary committee only reported to the Secretary of State on 23 December, two years after the process had started in 2007. He also ignored the fact that the delay has not been caused by the Government but by expensive and lengthy litigation on the ground, which has led to the timing of the Secretary of State's decision. My right hon. Friend the Member for Norwich, South (Mr. Clarke) gave an outline of that expensive and lengthy process, and its background, in a contribution that was both forceful and clear. The hon. Member for North Norfolk (Norman Lamb) flatly contradicted my right hon. Friend's assertion that this was something the people in the area want, feeling that the people of Norfolk had been ignored. As someone who saw the extent of this consultation and who knows that it received 2,800 representations, I simply cannot agree with the hon. Gentleman. Nor can I agree with the hon. Member for North-West Norfolk (Mr. Bellingham) that the creation of a unitary Norwich would not benefit Norfolk. As my hon. Friend the Member for Milton Keynes, South-West (Dr. Starkey) pointed out in her incisive contribution, Buckinghamshire has certainly benefited from the creation of Milton Keynes. The hon. Member for East Devon (Mr. Swire) illustrated the non-party-political nature of these decisions. He is against a unitary Exeter, despite the fact that his Conservative colleagues in Exeter are for it and that I saw them. He ignored the fact that until 1974 Exeter was independent of the county council and had been so for 800 years until the Conservatives changed it. We heard from the Opposition that the Labour leader of Devon county council is opposed to unitary change. In Norwich, the unitary proposal is supported by a coalition of Liberal Democrats, the Green party and Labour. In Suffolk, the Conservative leader of the county council strongly supports a unitary county. The issues are not simple and it is the task of Government to weigh these matters carefully, to balance competing arguments, to take a wider view in assessing the evidence and differing claims and, finally, to reach a judgment on the best way forward for all concerned. That is exactly what my right hon. Friends in the ministerial team have done and they have done it in the knowledge that before any unitary structure is created, these issues must be fully debated in this House and by another place. They must be agreed here. In the representations today, we have heard graphically from Exeter and Norwich just how the existing system has failed them. To conclude—