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National Insurance Contributions Bill

My Lords, in relation to what we are trying to achieve through the holiday scheme, it is important to create employment. The question of the nature of the activity which is being engaged in is one where again we want to be as permissive as we can be, consistent with the nature of the scheme. Although the noble Lord raised a number of other points going back to the question of boundaries between excluded and non-excluded regions, what we are principally talking about in the amendment is the type of trade or business which the activity is engaged in. In that context, as well as making the general point that what we are focusing on is maximising employment growth from a broad range of sectors, it might be worth saying a word or two about what property business includes. It covers activities including property rental, land rental and furnished holiday lettings; for example, I believe that the holiday could be particularly valuable in relation to furnished holiday lettings which, of course, would typically operate in rural areas and often provide employment where there are not other significant job opportunities. I would certainly like to think that the noble Lord, in proposing this amendment, was not intending to remove businesses from relief if that could, for example, prevent people or discourage people from providing holiday lettings, furnished cottages, apartments and so on. Similarly, on investment business, the Government’s view is that making investments and deriving profits from them is no less inherently a business than buying and selling any other tradable item. As the noble Lord says, there will be case-by-case determination by HMRC if there are questions about the validity of the trade or of boundaries. On the question of boundaries, the figures I quoted earlier were from the annual population survey statistics. I believe that, technically, the policy was founded on the national accounts statistics—which I could read out if the Committee was interested—which present the same picture. Indeed one set of numbers supports the other, but the annual population data, which I read out, gave a greater breakdown by the subregions. They present a similar picture, but I am advised that we looked at the national accounts statistics in coming up with the policy. This goes back, as the noble Lord said, to the question of a business being located in one place but jobs being created somewhere else. For simplicity, it is the place of the business that determines eligibility, so there could be some jobs located elsewhere, for which there is a benefit. This is true of all types of business and there is nothing particular to property and investment. If a business employs staff, they are likely to be located in or close to the main place of business. That issue is not strictly related to these particular amendments. As I have explained, the Government would not want to see perfectly valid and valuable categories of business—whether in property or investment—being excluded from the creation of good and worthwhile employment in the targeted regions. In view of that explanation, I hope that the noble Lord will withdraw the amendment.