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Committee of the Whole House (HL) and Debate on bill on Monday, 15 January 2007, in the House of Lords.

Mental Health Bill [HL]

Mental Health Bill (HL). Lords Committee stage third day. Clauses 5 to 7 agreed to. New clause under consideration. Part 1 of 2 records.

Secondary information

Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
688 c439-502 
Session
2006-07
Department
Department of Health
Legislative stage
Committee stage
Procedure
New clauses
Chamber / Committee
House of Lords chamber
Related items
Proceeding contributions
Baroness Royall of Blaisdon | 688 c502 (Link to this contribution) This may be an appropriate moment to move that the House be resumed for the Question for Short Debat...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 688 c500-1 (Link to this contribution) I am sorry that I shall disappoint the noble Baroness. I thought that today the Government have show...
Show all contributions (91)
Earl Howe | 688 c501-2 (Link to this contribution) The Minister has resisted the amendment and believes that the good practice approach is appropriate....
Lord Patel of Bradford | 688 c500 (Link to this contribution) I should like to make a brief contribution about Amendment No. 19. In part, the amendment is intende...
Baroness Masham of Ilton | 688 c500 (Link to this contribution) It is about time that the Minister accepted an amendment. This seems a good practice amendment, so I...
Baroness Murphy | 688 c499-500 (Link to this contribution) I rise to support this amendment. In particular, I want to speak about the second-opinion appointed ...
Lord Carlile of Berriew | 688 c498-9 (Link to this contribution) I wish to speak briefly in support of this amendment. The noble Earl is absolutely right when he spe...
Earl Howe | 688 c496-8 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 19: 19: After Clause 7 , insert the following new Clause— ““Other treatment sa...
Earl Howe | 688 c496 (Link to this contribution) Of course I accept the point put in that way. The noble Lord, Lord Patel, was surely right: clinical...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 688 c439 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I beg to move that the House do now again resolve itself into Committee on this Bill. Mov...
Earl Howe | 688 c441 (Link to this contribution) I support all that the noble Lord, Lord Carlile, has said, and I hope that the Minister will acknowl...
Lord Carlile of Berriew | 688 c439-41 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 8: 8: After Clause 4 , insert the following new Clause— ““Renewal of detention...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 688 c467-8 (Link to this contribution) Without commenting on the wording of the card, which I have not seen, I state that as a general prin...
Lord Patten | 688 c467 (Link to this contribution) The Minister is being extremely kind in his response, despite my unkind suggestion that he might eve...
Countess of Mar | 688 c468 (Link to this contribution) When inquiring into these points, the Minister should take the opportunity to look at what is being ...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 688 c468-9 (Link to this contribution) There are a number of issues here. I have asked the noble Baroness, Lady Knight, to supply me with s...
Lady Saltoun of Abernethy | 688 c468 (Link to this contribution) How quickly can the Minister take the actions that he has said he will? This is now a matter of cons...
Earl Howe | 688 c470-3 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 14: 14: After Clause 7 , insert the following new Clause— ““CHAPTER 1A Treatme...
Lord Carlile of Berriew | 688 c463-4 (Link to this contribution) My long-standing and considerable affection for the noble Baroness, Lady Knight, is equalled by my a...
Earl Howe | 688 c459 (Link to this contribution) I rise briefly to support my noble friend who spoke extremely powerfully on an issue which it is not...
Baroness Masham of Ilton | 688 c458-9 (Link to this contribution) In the rehab unit of a local hospital, which was also a place for very ill or dying patients, which ...
Baroness Knight of Collingtree | 688 c454-8 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 10: 10: After Clause 6 , insert the following new Clause— ““Provision of appro...
Baroness Murphy | 688 c454 (Link to this contribution) I thank the Minister for that careful response. There has been a creeping increase in the use of Sec...
Lord Patten | 688 c462 (Link to this contribution) New Tory. That was a Freudian slip, encouraged by the noble Lord, Lord Carlile. How things have chan...
Lord Patten | 688 c460-2 (Link to this contribution) I spoke during the proceedings on the Mental Capacity Bill when it was before your Lordships’ House....
Lady Saltoun of Abernethy | 688 c459-60 (Link to this contribution) The situation which the noble Baroness, Lady Knight, described seems to me to amount to nothing shor...
Baroness Royall of Blaisdon | 688 c453-4 (Link to this contribution) As we have heard, Amendment No. 9 would require all civil patients to be detained under Section 2 wh...
Baroness Finlay of Llandaff | 688 c462-3 (Link to this contribution) I rise briefly to comment on the amendments. The noble Baroness, Lady Knight of Collingtree, has don...
Lord Carlile of Berriew | 688 c448-9 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to those who have taken part in what has become an interesting and lively debate. I ca...
Baroness Royall of Blaisdon | 688 c448 (Link to this contribution) I understand that that is the point that the noble Countess was making, but we are talking about bes...
Earl Howe | 688 c450-1 (Link to this contribution) The noble Baroness speaks with tremendous authority on this issue, and I can only agree with all tha...
Baroness Murphy | 688 c449-50 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 9: 9: After Clause 5 , insert the following new Clause— ““Single gateway for t...
Baroness Murphy | 688 c447 (Link to this contribution) Before the Minister responds further, it may be helpful through the Committee to inform the noble Ba...
Lord Hylton | 688 c447 (Link to this contribution) I speak as a complete layman in these matters, but in view of the strength and quality of the six sp...
Countess of Mar | 688 c448 (Link to this contribution) The point that I was making was that in fact they will not be responsible for the person throughout ...
Baroness Royall of Blaisdon | 688 c448 (Link to this contribution) In response to the specific case raised by the noble Countess, and her fears, which I entirely under...
Baroness Neuberger | 688 c451-2 (Link to this contribution) I support the noble Baroness, Lady Murphy, and the noble Earl, Lord Howe. As many noble Lords know, ...
Baroness Meacher | 688 c452-3 (Link to this contribution) I shall be brief. I do not want to repeat what other noble Lords have said, but I want to register m...
Baroness Royall of Blaisdon | 688 c447 (Link to this contribution) Indeed, in the House of Lords we have the most distinguished people available in many areas, includi...
Baroness Royall of Blaisdon | 688 c445-6 (Link to this contribution) Amendment No. 8 concerns patients whose period of compulsory treatment under the Act has come up for...
Baroness Finlay of Llandaff | 688 c444-5 (Link to this contribution) This issue was put to me very simply by a psychiatrist when we were discussing some of the ongoing p...
Countess of Mar | 688 c444 (Link to this contribution) I heartily endorse what previous speakers have said. I am sorry that I have intervened so late in th...
Baroness Murphy | 688 c443-4 (Link to this contribution) There is one occasion in the 1983 Act, in Section 141, where you can have the renewal of detention a...
Baroness Meacher | 688 c441-3 (Link to this contribution) The Government have rightly upheld the 1983 Act requirement that a detention order, whether made und...
Countess of Mar | 688 c447 (Link to this contribution) The noble Baroness described the situation for a patient under ideal circumstances. In my experience...
Baroness Masham of Ilton | 688 c447 (Link to this contribution) If the patient does not agree with his or her treatment, do they have a right of appeal or the right...
Baroness Royall of Blaisdon | 688 c447 (Link to this contribution) I regret that I do not have that information. I will write to the noble Baroness and place a copy of...
Baroness Neuberger | 688 c491-2 (Link to this contribution) I support everything that the noble Earl, Lord Howe, said and simply add one other piece of evidence...
Lord Patel of Bradford | 688 c492-3 (Link to this contribution) I rise to speak to Amendment No. 18. I have great sympathy with the purpose of this amendment and gr...
Baroness Meacher | 688 c494 (Link to this contribution) I had not planned to speak to this amendment but wish to make one point. I was involved in the devel...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 688 c494-5 (Link to this contribution) Of course I will give careful consideration to the debate. The noble Earl, Lord Howe, said that pati...
Lord Bragg | 688 c493 (Link to this contribution) I support Amendments Nos. 18 and 19, tabled by the noble Earl. We now know that medicines used to tr...
Baroness Chalker of Wallasey | 688 c493-4 (Link to this contribution) I support the amendment tabled by my noble friend Lord Howe. The Minister will remember from our deb...
Earl Howe | 688 c496 (Link to this contribution) I am immensely grateful for the authoritative support of the noble Lord, Lord Patel of Bradford, and...
Baroness Barker | 688 c495 (Link to this contribution) Will the noble Lord share with the Committee the basis on which that calculation was made? Perhaps h...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 688 c495 (Link to this contribution) In fairness, these are estimates, and detailed work would need to be done in relation to the amendme...
Baroness Masham of Ilton | 688 c488 (Link to this contribution) This sounds really rather concerning. I ask the noble Earl how many sub-standard units there are in ...
Earl Howe | 688 c488 (Link to this contribution) If I may answer that question a little later on, it may be helpful to the Committee.
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 688 c488-9 (Link to this contribution) It is entirely understandable that noble Lords have raised the question of how services are, essenti...
Lord Carlile of Berriew | 688 c489 (Link to this contribution) Before the Minister sits down, will he please answer my question? Why have the Government withdrawn ...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 688 c489 (Link to this contribution) I thought that in the previous group of amendments on ECT we debated the issue of consent. I said to...
Lord Carlile of Berriew | 688 c489 (Link to this contribution) I apologise to the noble Lord. I was absent for part of the previous debate, and I obviously missed ...
Earl Howe | 688 c489-90 (Link to this contribution) I thank noble Lords who have spoken in the debate. I am grateful to the Minister for his reply, whic...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 688 c490 (Link to this contribution) Would the noble Earl, Lord Howe, find it helpful if, as well as asking my officials to discuss with ...
Earl Howe | 688 c490-1 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 18: 18: After Clause 7 , insert the following new Clause— ““Administration of ...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 688 c484 (Link to this contribution) I am not in an enviable position as a Minister trying to refer to specific treatment cases when such...
Lord Patel of Blackburn | 688 c478-80 (Link to this contribution) As I have previously declared, I am chairman of the Mental Health Act Commission and as such I have ...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 688 c480-3 (Link to this contribution) It is entirely understandable that there should have been a debate about ECT which reflects both his...
Lord Carlile of Berriew | 688 c487 (Link to this contribution) Clauses 178 to 184 of the draft Bill of 2004 contained safeguards in relation to ECT. The committee ...
Baroness Finlay of Llandaff | 688 c487-8 (Link to this contribution) An area that has not yet been mentioned is the danger of anoxia from poor anaesthetic maintenance te...
Baroness Neuberger | 688 c486-7 (Link to this contribution) I support the noble Earl, Lord Howe, in this amendment. I will not speak long, as we are running beh...
Earl Howe | 688 c484-5 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to all noble Lords who spoke in this debate. I am particularly grateful for the suppor...
Earl Howe | 688 c485-6 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 17: 17: After Clause 7 , insert the following new Clause— ““ECT compliance wit...
Lord Bragg | 688 c473 (Link to this contribution) I rise briefly to support the amendment proposed by the noble Earl, Lord Howe, and echo what he said...
Countess of Mar | 688 c473 (Link to this contribution) I also support the amendment. My mother would have been enormously grateful to the noble Earl, Lord ...
Baroness Neuberger | 688 c473-4 (Link to this contribution) Other noble Lords have said a great deal to support the amendments in this group. I shall speak very...
Baroness Meacher | 688 c476-8 (Link to this contribution) I also support Amendment No. 15, tabled in the name of the noble Earl, Lord Howe, and will limit my ...
Lord Acton | 688 c478 (Link to this contribution) Of the studies that the noble Baroness quoted, was the benefit of ECT shown soon after it was given,...
Baroness Meacher | 688 c478 (Link to this contribution) To my knowledge, the effects tend to happen very soon after ECT is given. I think there were studies...
Baroness Murphy | 688 c474-5 (Link to this contribution) ECT is not getting a very good press here tonight. So, while strongly supporting these amendments, I...
Bishop of Ripon and Leeds | 688 c475-6 (Link to this contribution) I support the amendments and the noble Earl, Lord Howe, in his presentation of them. This is perhaps...
Lord Williamson of Horton | 688 c476 (Link to this contribution) I join the noble Earl, Lord Howe, and others in hoping that the Minister will be able to respond fav...
Lord Patel | 688 c476 (Link to this contribution) I support these amendments. I agree that if there had been an amendment that banned ECT for under 18...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 688 c464-7 (Link to this contribution) I congratulate the noble Baroness, Lady Knight, on taking the opportunity to bring before us what ar...
Earl Howe | 688 c490 (Link to this contribution) That is a helpful undertaking, and I am extremely grateful. I shall withdraw the amendment, of cours...
Baroness Knight of Collingtree | 688 c469-70 (Link to this contribution) I appreciate more than I can say the very kind and generous way in which the Minister has replied to...
Earl of Onslow | 688 c446-7 (Link to this contribution) Did the noble Baroness alter a single word of her brief from what was written down for her before th...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 688 c496 (Link to this contribution) It would be unfair to say that some of the changes we are making as a result of this Bill are a cost...
Baroness Murphy | 688 c483-4 (Link to this contribution) Before the noble Lord finishes, I should like to press him on Section 62 emergency treatment and rem...
Baroness Murphy | 688 c487 (Link to this contribution) The noble Earl, Lord Howe, and the noble Baroness, Lady Neuberger, have said it all. I know that the...
Subjects
Children Codes of practice Admissions Consent to medical treatment Compulsorily detained psychiatric patients Diagnosis Food Electroconvulsive therapy Mental illness Medical treatments Patients' rights Mental health services Mental health Psychiatric hospitals Standards Young people Safety Testing
Legislation
Mental Health Bill (HL) 2006-07
Link
View this Parliamentary proceeding on www.publications.parliament.uk