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Debate on Monday, 3 March 2008, in the House of Commons, led by Jim Murphy. The answering member was Mark Francois.

Business of the House (Lisbon Treaty) (No. 8)

Debate on a business motion regarding consideration of the Treaty of Lisbon. Agreed on division (276 to 198).

Secondary information

Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
472 c1454-71 
Session
2007-08
Department
Foreign and Commonwealth Office
Procedure
Timetabling of bills
Business motions
Chamber / Committee
House of Commons chamber
Related items
Proceeding contributions
Lord Deben | 472 c1467 (Link to this contribution) The Government must think again. There is no doubt that there is much in the Lisbon treaty to debate...
David Drew | 472 c1467-8 (Link to this contribution) Views on the EU and the Lisbon treaty transcend the party political spectrum. There are a number of ...
Show all contributions (89)
Lord Lilley | 472 c1467 (Link to this contribution) I shall be brief. In compensation for breaking a solemn manifesto pledge to hold a referendum, the G...
Ed Davey | 472 c1466-7 (Link to this contribution) I strongly agree with the right hon. and learned Gentleman. We often go through a charade and preten...
Lord Clarke of Nottingham | 472 c1466 (Link to this contribution) I have long believed that, if we are to have timetabling, which apparently now applies to all Bills,...
Ed Davey | 472 c1466 (Link to this contribution) I do not often agree with the hon. Member for Rayleigh (Mr. Francois), or the hon. Member for Crewe ...
Gwyneth Dunwoody | 472 c1465-6 (Link to this contribution) I shall speak very briefly. We should be quite clear about what is happening here. This legislation ...
Baroness Stuart of Edgbaston | 472 c1465 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman may be making a powerful case, but it is also a completely pointless case. Unaccu...
Mark Francois | 472 c1465 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady is of course entitled to her view, but if we had had an opportunity to debate a number...
William Cash | 472 c1465 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend will recall that on 20 June, the deceitful manner in which this process has been cond...
Mark Francois | 472 c1465 (Link to this contribution) Again, my hon. Friend is entirely right, and I suspect that he will return to that point briefly lat...
Mark Francois | 472 c1465 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is entirely right. In days of yore, there use to be an offence of breach of promise, ...
Mark Francois | 472 c1461 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend has scrutinised the treaty in detail, and as usual he has made an important point. Th...
Lord Clarke of Nottingham | 472 c1461 (Link to this contribution) This is yet another motion that slightly amends the timetable. Although my hon. Friend has acknowled...
Mark Francois | 472 c1462 (Link to this contribution) As an ex-Whip, I have learned never to comment in the Chamber on any discussions through the usual c...
Lord Deben | 472 c1460 (Link to this contribution) Will my hon. Friend point out that some of us want a debate on defence in order to show that the tre...
Speaker | 472 c1460 (Link to this contribution) Order. The debate is going wide of the business motion.
Mark Francois | 472 c1460-1 (Link to this contribution) As has been said, we really did want that extra day on defence. It has emerged that we have the res...
James Clappison | 472 c1461 (Link to this contribution) Is my hon. Friend aware that the Foreign Affairs Committee's analysis of the defence provisions of t...
Mark Francois | 472 c1464 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful for the gentle wave. I am not accustomed to that from the hon. Lady, but I will take i...
Richard Shepherd | 472 c1464 (Link to this contribution) Will my hon. Friend note, too, that a day is not a day in the sense that the public outside understa...
Mark Francois | 472 c1464 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend, who has, as usual, followed these debates very closely, makes a powerful point. I re...
Mark Francois | 472 c1464 (Link to this contribution) I will, but only briefly because I sense that other Members want to speak.
Lord Harper | 472 c1464 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is making a powerful case. Is it not worse than he suggests, because not only have al...
Speaker | 472 c1464 (Link to this contribution) I think that that is for the editors of Hansard to work out for themselves.
Lord Deben | 472 c1464 (Link to this contribution) On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. Could you explain to Hansard how to put down in the record ...
Speaker | 472 c1464 (Link to this contribution) I am sure that the editors of Hansard will be very grateful for those remarks.
Gwyneth Dunwoody | 472 c1464 (Link to this contribution) Could I just explain that I was waving genteelly in the direction of the hon. Member for Rayleigh (M...
Mark Francois | 472 c1462-3 (Link to this contribution) We will continue the discussion in the Tea Room, but my hon. Friend is entirely right. On day seven...
Lord Deben | 472 c1463 (Link to this contribution) Will my hon. Friend be careful not to allow the Government to get away with the idea that they have ...
Mark Francois | 472 c1462 (Link to this contribution) I thank my hon. Friend for giving way—[Laughter.] I am well aware of Mr. Giscard d'Estaing's comment...
Speaker | 472 c1462 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman, too, address the motion under debate?
Mark Francois | 472 c1463 (Link to this contribution) I thank the hon. Lady. We have not laid down at all—we opposed the Government's motion and voted aga...
Mark Francois | 472 c1463 (Link to this contribution) My right hon. Friend has made a pertinent point, which I wish to reinforce. It is even worse when th...
Gwyneth Dunwoody | 472 c1463 (Link to this contribution) In view of the unequivocal views quoted by the hon. Gentleman, can he explain why his Front Benchers...
Speaker | 472 c1462 (Link to this contribution) Order. That intervention was very wide of the motion under discussion. We are talking about the busi...
Nicholas Winterton | 472 c1462 (Link to this contribution) I am not sure that my hon. Friend should be concerned about his career—he should be concerned about ...
Mark Francois | 472 c1462 (Link to this contribution) I shall do so only briefly, because I would like to move on to a related point.
Baroness Stuart of Edgbaston | 472 c1456 (Link to this contribution) I absolutely agree with the Minister when he says that all of us know our constituencies better than...
Mark Pritchard | 472 c1455-6 (Link to this contribution) I know that the Minister always likes to be transparent with the House: when he said that one in six...
Jim Murphy | 472 c1456 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman knows his constituency better than I do, and I hope that he would accept that all...
Lord Lilley | 472 c1456 (Link to this contribution) If the turnout in local elections in the Minister's and other constituencies falls below that achiev...
Jim Murphy | 472 c1456 (Link to this contribution) The place to make decisions is in this Chamber, not in a crane in the sky above London. This Chamber...
William Cash | 472 c1456 (Link to this contribution) Does the Minister agree that, when he mentions the Nice, Maastricht and Amsterdam treaties, he ignor...
Jim Murphy | 472 c1456 (Link to this contribution) No, the mandate is clear, and has been clear on each day of the debate. Every Government of the Euro...
Speaker | 472 c1456 (Link to this contribution) Order. We are now at the stage of debating the issues, which is not what this motion is about.
Jim Murphy | 472 c1456 (Link to this contribution) Thank you, Mr. Speaker, for your encouragement.
Jim Murphy | 472 c1455 (Link to this contribution) In my constituency, fewer than one in six of the electorate voted for a referendum. The timetable se...
Nicholas Winterton | 472 c1455 (Link to this contribution) In the light of the point made by my hon. Friend the Member for Castle Point (Bob Spink)—that an ove...
Jim Murphy | 472 c1455 (Link to this contribution) May I say to my hon. Friend the Member for Crewe and Nantwich (Mrs. Dunwoody) that our affection for...
Bob Spink | 472 c1454 (Link to this contribution) Following this weekend's astounding referendum results, does the Minister not believe that it is now...
Jim Murphy | 472 c1454-5 (Link to this contribution) We are not tempted by that approach. I cannot congratulate the hon. Gentleman in the same way as I e...
Jim Murphy | 472 c1454 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move,"That the Order of 28th January be further amended as follows—""(1) in paragraph (1) f...
Gwyneth Dunwoody | 472 c1455 (Link to this contribution) I am always impressed with the Minister's tact and charm. I have tabled an amendment for Wednesday, ...
Speaker | 472 c1455 (Link to this contribution) Order. That is a matter for the Chairman of Ways and Means.
Lord Harper | 472 c1455 (Link to this contribution) I thought that the Minister was going to say that I had a different view about the timing. I had sai...
Jim Murphy | 472 c1455 (Link to this contribution) The business of the House motion guarantees a certain number of hours of debate, as the hon. Gentlem...
Jim Murphy | 472 c1458 (Link to this contribution) Mr. Speaker, I know that you will accept that I am simply responding to the interventions that I tak...
Lord Deben | 472 c1458 (Link to this contribution) But does not the Minister understand how difficult he is making things, even for those of us who sup...
Jim Murphy | 472 c1458 (Link to this contribution) I hope that it does not unsettle the right hon. Gentleman if I disagree with him. Where there is an ...
Speaker | 472 c1458 (Link to this contribution) Order. We have to get back to the business of the House motion.
Lord Clarke of Nottingham | 472 c1457-8 (Link to this contribution) The Minister always makes comparisons with treaties that were much shorter and much less controversi...
Jim Murphy | 472 c1458 (Link to this contribution) Of course, on these issues of substance and on some of the policy issues that relate to Europe, I fi...
James Clappison | 472 c1457 (Link to this contribution) So that we can determine how much time will be required and given what the Minister has said about w...
Jim Murphy | 472 c1457 (Link to this contribution) The total number of days available for the House to discuss the Lisbon treaty and the Bill to enact ...
David Drew | 472 c1457 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend accept that a fundamentally different situation now faces us in that, if the des...
Jim Murphy | 472 c1457 (Link to this contribution) As I am against holding one referendum, it will hardly come as a surprise to my hon. Friend to learn...
Jim Murphy | 472 c1457 (Link to this contribution) I accept that it is probably the last in this debate; I have only one paragraph left of my comments ...
Bob Spink | 472 c1457 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the Minister, and I promise him that this will be the last time that I intervene on...
Jim Murphy | 472 c1457 (Link to this contribution) I will not hold the hon. Gentleman to his assertion that that was the last time that he will interve...
Speaker | 472 c1456 (Link to this contribution) Order. That is beyond the scope of the business motion.
Jim Murphy | 472 c1457 (Link to this contribution) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I shall return to the business motion.
Gwyneth Dunwoody | 472 c1459 (Link to this contribution) May I upset my hon. Friend once more?
Mark Francois | 472 c1458-9 (Link to this contribution) I thank the Minister for giving way. My point is directly about the motion, Mr. Speaker. The Ministe...
Mark Francois | 472 c1459-60 (Link to this contribution) The Minister referred to the previous business of the House motion, so I shall do so too, if I may. ...
Jim Murphy | 472 c1459 (Link to this contribution) I shall conclude my remarks—my one paragraph. We have varied the motion on six occasions. On each of...
Jim Murphy | 472 c1459 (Link to this contribution) Of course the procedure was recommended by the Government, but it was decided on by the House, which...
Gwyneth Dunwoody | 472 c1459 (Link to this contribution) I hope that my hon. Friend will make it clear that it was the Government who proposed the procedure:...
Mark Francois | 472 c1460 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend has made a powerful point. In the run-up to these debates, the Government repeatedly ...
William Cash | 472 c1460 (Link to this contribution) As the amendments relating to defence were tabled in my name, I concur with my hon. Friend the Membe...
Speaker | 472 c1458 (Link to this contribution) I know that it will be; I am trying to tell the Minister that we have to get back to the motion.
Jim Murphy | 472 c1459 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman makes his point in his own way. The fact is that the Conservatives tabled a subst...
Subjects
European Union Parliamentary procedure Parliamentary scrutiny Treaties Treaty of Lisbon
Link
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