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Topical debate on Thursday, 27 March 2008, in the House of Commons, led by Tony McNulty. The answering member was David Ruffley.

Policing in London

Topical debate on policing in London.

Secondary information

Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
474 c351-78 
Session
2007-08
Department
Home Office
Chamber / Committee
House of Commons chamber
Proceeding contributions
Speaker | 474 c373 (Link to this contribution) Order. I ask the hon. Gentleman to withdraw those remarks.
Speaker | 474 c373 (Link to this contribution) Order. I ask the hon. Gentleman withdraw that remark and move on in his speech.
Show all contributions (148)
Andy Slaughter | 474 c370-1 (Link to this contribution) I certainly do—it is another excellent appointment. My only problem with the borough commanders that...
Andy Slaughter | 474 c371 (Link to this contribution) I entirely agree that that is a serious problem. The death of Kodyo Yenga in Hammersmith and Fulham ...
Tom Brake | 474 c371 (Link to this contribution) Does the hon. Gentleman agree that one area of concern, which is borne out by the statistics, is wha...
Andy Slaughter | 474 c371 (Link to this contribution) I accept that. Of course, as he is an Oxfordshire MP, perhaps he should not have been present at all...
Speaker | 474 c371 (Link to this contribution) Order. I have already ruled that I will not allow comments to be made about who is or is not in the ...
Clive Efford | 474 c371 (Link to this contribution) When the hon. Member for Bury St. Edmunds (Mr. Ruffley) talked about crime figures, he took 1998 as ...
Speaker | 474 c371 (Link to this contribution) Order. I remind the hon. Gentleman of my ruling.
Andy Slaughter | 474 c371 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to my hon. Friend. I know that he wants to speak and I shall therefore say what I need...
Stephen Pound | 474 c372 (Link to this contribution) We have seen failures, as we certainly did in the Brixton command not too recently. Does my hon. Fri...
Andy Slaughter | 474 c372 (Link to this contribution) I have an image in my head that I wish would go away.
Clive Efford | 474 c373 (Link to this contribution) Before the hon. Member for Henley (Mr. Johnson) became the candidate for London Mayor, he mentioned ...
Andy Slaughter | 474 c372 (Link to this contribution) I agree that a little more control is needed on all sides, Madam Deputy Speaker. When Hammersmith a...
Harry Cohen | 474 c373 (Link to this contribution) You are absolutely right, Madam Deputy Speaker, to admonish my hon. Friend for referring to the hon....
Andy Slaughter | 474 c373 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful, Madam Deputy Speaker. The Conservative Front-Bench spokesman specifically said that h...
Speaker | 474 c373 (Link to this contribution) Order. I said earlier in the debate that the manifestos of individual candidates must not be given. ...
Andy Slaughter | 474 c373 (Link to this contribution) His financial illiteracy extends not only to policing, as we have heard. The Conservative spokesman ...
Andy Slaughter | 474 c373 (Link to this contribution) I agree. Racist crime in London has fallen by 55 per cent. since 2000. I do not need to say much abo...
Robert Neill | 474 c375 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that the very real concern that he highlights has regrettably been exacerb...
James Brokenshire | 474 c374 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend makes an important and powerful point. One of the most disturbing trends that we have...
Simon Hughes | 474 c375 (Link to this contribution) Does the hon. Gentleman accept that the police and London Members across the party divide believe th...
James Brokenshire | 474 c375 (Link to this contribution) Crime among young people is a real problem. We need to be careful in how we phrase our comments, bec...
Andy Slaughter | 474 c373 (Link to this contribution) I did move on, but—[Hon. Members: ““Withdraw.””] I withdraw the comment that I made; I will let the ...
Mark Field | 474 c374 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that such tragic murders give rise to the perception—the Minister may be c...
James Brokenshire | 474 c374 (Link to this contribution) It is right that Conservative Members should record all the hard work of the police—the City force, ...
Andy Slaughter | 474 c373 (Link to this contribution) I withdraw those remarks and replace them with the words that he actually used. He used the expressi...
James Brokenshire | 474 c375-6 (Link to this contribution) The whole issue of witness protection is extremely important, particularly in the case of gang crime...
Speaker | 474 c378 (Link to this contribution) I understand the concerns of hon. Members who sought to take part in the debate and were not able to...
Clive Efford | 474 c378 (Link to this contribution) Further to that point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. I came to the Chamber for business questions two...
Mark Field | 474 c378 (Link to this contribution) On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. In no way is this meant as a criticism of the Chair, but in...
Tony McNulty | 474 c377-8 (Link to this contribution) I apologise: the hon. Gentleman looks nothing like the hon. Member for Upminster (Angela Watkinson)....
Tony McNulty | 474 c376-7 (Link to this contribution) I apologise for calling you Madam Mayor earlier, Madam Deputy Speaker. As my hon. Friend the Member...
James Brokenshire | 474 c376 (Link to this contribution) We need to ensure that there is more local control over policing priorities, to ensure that they do ...
Andrew Rosindell | 474 c376 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that the current arrangements, whereby police are based in wards instead o...
James Brokenshire | 474 c376 (Link to this contribution) We need to focus on proper policing on the streets. That is why I support measures that cut bureaucr...
Harry Cohen | 474 c376 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for giving way, because I know that time is short. He is making ...
David Burrowes | 474 c361 (Link to this contribution) In the context of a police presence in our communities, does my hon. Friend recognise the crucial ro...
David Ruffley | 474 c361-2 (Link to this contribution) In the past 10 years, under this Government, there have been net falls across the country, including...
Richard Ottaway | 474 c362 (Link to this contribution) In London, which has huge diversity, only 20 per cent. of police officers are female and only 8 per ...
David Ruffley | 474 c362 (Link to this contribution) That has not been done; there is no sense in which the stop and search form is a paperless transacti...
Speaker | 474 c362 (Link to this contribution) Order. We are not here to discuss individual candidates' manifestos, but policing in London.
David Ruffley | 474 c362 (Link to this contribution) It is an important point on which there is cross-party agreement. The chief constable of Cheshire, P...
Andrew Dismore | 474 c363 (Link to this contribution) This is a very opportune time to have this debate, with the Metropolitan police at its highest ever ...
David Ruffley | 474 c363 (Link to this contribution) I defer to you, Madam Deputy Speaker, but after listening to the Labour attacks on my hon. Friend th...
Boris Johnson | 474 c363 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
Andrew Dismore | 474 c364-5 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend makes a good point. It has happened because the Mayor of London, working with the Lab...
Andrew Love | 474 c365 (Link to this contribution) I thank my hon. Friend for giving way—and I also regret that the hon. Member for Henley has left the...
Andrew Dismore | 474 c363-4 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman will get his chance later. He is aiming to cut the Met's reserve budget for major...
Stephen Pound | 474 c364 (Link to this contribution) This morning, I was out with the Perivale safer neighbourhoods team on what we call a partnership da...
Clive Efford | 474 c365 (Link to this contribution) On the subject of CCTV cameras, when we had a problem with vandalism on the buses—something the hon....
Andrew Dismore | 474 c365 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend makes an extremely important point. Perhaps that is because the people whom we repres...
Andrew Love | 474 c365 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that the Opposition have not prioritised the issue of antisocial behaviour...
Speaker | 474 c365 (Link to this contribution) Order. We do not make references to whether Members are in or out of the Chamber.
Greg Hands | 474 c365 (Link to this contribution) May I correct something the hon. Gentleman said? I have a copy of the transport manifesto of my hon....
Andrew Dismore | 474 c365 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend makes an important point. The fact remains that there is now CCTV on every bus in Lon...
David Ruffley | 474 c366 (Link to this contribution) I am listening with interest. Can the hon. Gentleman give the source of those statistics? Are they r...
Andrew Dismore | 474 c366 (Link to this contribution) The statistics are from the Metropolitan Police Service performance information bureau. I am sure th...
Andrew Dismore | 474 c366 (Link to this contribution) Vehicle crime is down 16.8 per cent.
Andrew Dismore | 474 c366 (Link to this contribution) As was said earlier, that cannot be paid for in the way that the hon. Member for Henley proposes. Ho...
Speaker | 474 c367 (Link to this contribution) That is not a point of order for the Chair, but it is not uncommon for Members to refer to notes.
Speaker | 474 c366 (Link to this contribution) Order. It is very clear that the hon. Gentleman is not prepared to give way at present.
Justine Greening | 474 c366 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman give way on that point?
David Ruffley | 474 c367 (Link to this contribution) On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. With reference to ““Erskine May””, is it in order for a M...
Andrew Dismore | 474 c366-7 (Link to this contribution) Violent crime is down by 4 per cent. We have had a particular problem with burglary, especially viol...
Simon Hughes | 474 c369-70 (Link to this contribution) There is a great inconsistency in the promises and delivery of the Mayor and the current Administrat...
Tom Brake | 474 c370 (Link to this contribution) I thank my hon. Friend for that helpful intervention, which highlights the fact that what is often s...
Andrew Dismore | 474 c367-8 (Link to this contribution) I suspect people would not like money to be spent on public relations. That is inevitable; that will...
Tom Brake | 474 c368-9 (Link to this contribution) I echo the tributes paid to the police for the dangerous job that they do. I also welcome the fact t...
Andrew Dismore | 474 c367 (Link to this contribution) I was not reading a speech; I was reading out the numbers. The hon. Gentleman may not appreciate the...
David Burrowes | 474 c367 (Link to this contribution) What would the hon. Gentleman's constituents say if he were to put a question in one of his numerous...
Andy Slaughter | 474 c370 (Link to this contribution) Before I make a few brief remarks, may I offer my congratulations to my borough commander, Ali Dizae...
Speaker | 474 c370 (Link to this contribution) Order. The hon. Gentleman's time is up.
David Ruffley | 474 c360 (Link to this contribution) Unless the Government can show what they have done to cut red tape in the last 10 years, they will h...
Greg Hands | 474 c360 (Link to this contribution) May I return my hon. Friend for a moment to the subject of high-visibility policing? I know that ear...
David Ruffley | 474 c360-1 (Link to this contribution) I was impressed by it. It is not cheap, and the Conservative council should be commended for saying ...
David Ruffley | 474 c361 (Link to this contribution) I am now happy to give way to the hon. Gentleman.
Stephen Pound | 474 c361 (Link to this contribution) I am extremely grateful. The hon. Gentleman is characteristically generous. The hon. Gentleman ment...
David Ruffley | 474 c361 (Link to this contribution) Absolutely not. The Police and Criminal Evidence Act was a Conservative piece of criminal justice le...
David Ruffley | 474 c360 (Link to this contribution) I will in a minute. Not even the men and women in the Police Federation believe the Minister when h...
Stephen Pound | 474 c360 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
David Ruffley | 474 c359-60 (Link to this contribution) I wish to make some progress first. If the Minister will not accept statistics in black and white, ...
Joan Ryan | 474 c359 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Member for Henley (Mr. Johnson) represents one of the safest constituencies in the country,...
David Ruffley | 474 c359 (Link to this contribution) I would rather take my hon. Friend's powerful point than the fiddled and dodgy numbers and spin put ...
David Ruffley | 474 c359 (Link to this contribution) That statistic from Putney speaks volumes.
Harry Cohen | 474 c359 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
David Ruffley | 474 c359 (Link to this contribution) The right hon. Lady's rather thin and, frankly, pathetic intervention shows how scared Labour Member...
Justine Greening | 474 c359 (Link to this contribution) The net police precept in my constituency has quadrupled over the past 10 years, but we have not see...
Boris Johnson | 474 c359 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that the huge majority of Londoners would listen with more interest to the...
Tony McNulty | 474 c356-7 (Link to this contribution) A trio of lamentables—Camden, Islington and the hon. Gentleman. I need to say in conclusion, Madam ...
Speaker | 474 c357 (Link to this contribution) Order. The right hon. Gentleman's time is up.
Tony McNulty | 474 c356 (Link to this contribution) I shall give way to a rather serious London MP, rather than go out of London.
Robert Neill | 474 c356 (Link to this contribution) Given the Minister's concern about ill-informed criticism of police in London, will he join me in co...
David Ruffley | 474 c357 (Link to this contribution) In a moment. The current Mayor wants London to be the safest city in the world, but after eight yea...
Andrew Love | 474 c357 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
Andrew Love | 474 c357 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman give way.
Tony McNulty | 474 c358 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
David Ruffley | 474 c358 (Link to this contribution) I will give way to the Minister in a moment. On 11 March 2008, the current Mayor of London told the...
David Ruffley | 474 c358 (Link to this contribution) I shall be happy to listen to the Minister if he can answer my questions.
Tony McNulty | 474 c358 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman simply cannot do this. He must quote the figures accurately. The 182,000 offences...
David Ruffley | 474 c358 (Link to this contribution) I invite anyone who reads Hansard tomorrow to read what I have said, and then to view the Home Offic...
David Ruffley | 474 c357-8 (Link to this contribution) In a moment. Even the Home Secretary herself has said that either in Hackney or in south Kensington...
Andrew Love | 474 c358 (Link to this contribution) I thank the hon. Gentleman for giving way and commend him for giving selective figures. Does he acce...
David Ruffley | 474 c358 (Link to this contribution) I will offer no such congratulation to the Mayor of London, whose record I will get on to in a momen...
Tony McNulty | 474 c354 (Link to this contribution) That is a reasonable point, whether about Highgate or elsewhere. As I have discovered in my area, it...
Baroness Featherstone | 474 c354 (Link to this contribution) The safer neighbourhoods teams have been a phenomenal addition and they are greatly appreciated by l...
Tony McNulty | 474 c354 (Link to this contribution) So keen that the hon. Member for Henley has not mentioned that at all during his entire life in the ...
Mark Field | 474 c354 (Link to this contribution) The Minister will be aware that I have supported PCSOs since the moment the idea was raised in the H...
Tony McNulty | 474 c353 (Link to this contribution) That might look nice in a central office press release, but it is simply not the case. Whoever the c...
Lee Scott | 474 c353 (Link to this contribution) Does the Minister accept that one of the concerns of my constituents in Ilford, North and people thr...
Tony McNulty | 474 c353 (Link to this contribution) I absolutely agree. The Conservative party has had an on-off—now on, apparently—love affair with PCS...
Andrew Love | 474 c353 (Link to this contribution) I agree strongly with my right hon. Friend's support for the Metropolitan Police Service and the ini...
Joan Ryan | 474 c354 (Link to this contribution) I find it hard to believe that the hon. Member for Henley (Mr. Johnson) is at all serious about figh...
Tony McNulty | 474 c354-5 (Link to this contribution) I can only agree with my right hon. Friend. We have a candidate who has delivered substantially for ...
Tom Brake | 474 c356 (Link to this contribution) I thank the Minister for giving way as he has made some unsubstantiated allegations about Liberal De...
Tony McNulty | 474 c356 (Link to this contribution) I promised to come to Carshalton and on and on.
Tony McNulty | 474 c356 (Link to this contribution) The important point is that PCSOs have the requisite skills base for the job that they are intended ...
Speaker | 474 c356 (Link to this contribution) Order. We are discussing policing in London. Perhaps the Minister will respond on that.
Clive Efford | 474 c355 (Link to this contribution) On the issue of the conversion of the Conservatives to supporting PCSOs, does my right hon. Friend r...
Harry Cohen | 474 c355 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to my right hon. Friend for giving way. Can he give an assessment of what Londoners ar...
Tony McNulty | 474 c356 (Link to this contribution) At some stage, I shall, and I am sure that my private secretary would enjoy it enormously, seeing as...
Tony McNulty | 474 c351 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move,"That this House has considered the matter of policing in London." I am pleased to mo...
Tony McNulty | 474 c351 (Link to this contribution) I would if those who proposed such policy developments could justify and sustain the funding for tho...
Philip Hollobone | 474 c351 (Link to this contribution) Many of my constituents travel to and work in London, and they are very interested in policing in th...
Boris Johnson | 474 c351 (Link to this contribution) Will the right hon. Gentleman give way?
Tony McNulty | 474 c351 (Link to this contribution) Wait a minute. What I would not accept is the costing that has been suggested so far, because it is ...
Boris Johnson | 474 c351-2 (Link to this contribution) Since the Minister asked a question, I would be delighted to enlighten him. Let me tell him that Lon...
Tony McNulty | 474 c352 (Link to this contribution) In the first instance when the proposal was thought up, the money was to come from Transport for Lon...
Tony McNulty | 474 c352 (Link to this contribution) I agree with my hon. Friend entirely. We know that an election is forthcoming, but the hon. Member f...
Clive Efford | 474 c352 (Link to this contribution) I am slightly confused by the position of the hon. Member for Henley (Mr. Johnson) because Tory asse...
Tony McNulty | 474 c352 (Link to this contribution) Not in London, with the greatest respect.
Tony McNulty | 474 c353 (Link to this contribution) Over the past few years, the safety figures for London have been going in the right direction much m...
Tony McNulty | 474 c352 (Link to this contribution) I shall come to the outer fringe of London—Surrey—first and then Essex.
Richard Ottaway | 474 c352 (Link to this contribution) Croydon is very much a part of London. May I try to take a different tack? A recent survey showed th...
Speaker | 474 c372 (Link to this contribution) Order. Please may we have some order in the Chamber and a debate on policing in London?
Stephen Pound | 474 c370 (Link to this contribution) Tribute has been paid to the borough commander in Hammersmith and Fulham by my hon. Friend, who also...
David Ruffley | 474 c359 (Link to this contribution) I apologise, Madam Deputy Speaker. Let me simply say that the spin-addicted Minister may decide to r...
Tony McNulty | 474 c355 (Link to this contribution) I give way to Leyton and Wanstead.
Tony McNulty | 474 c355 (Link to this contribution) I suspect that the hon. Member for Henley has had another conversion and now accepts that there are ...
Speaker | 474 c359 (Link to this contribution) Order. There is a bit of a heated debate going on in the Chamber, but perhaps the hon. Gentleman wil...
David Ruffley | 474 c357 (Link to this contribution) I have a lot of regard for the Minister, but he plumbed new depths with his rather churlish approach...
Subjects
Crime prevention Crime British Transport Police Greater London Local government Police Police community support officers Metropolitan Police
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