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Opposition day on Tuesday, 3 February 2009, in the House of Commons, led by Tim Loughton. The answering member was Ed Balls.

Child Protection

Child protection. Fourth Opposition Day debate (part 2). Motion negatived on division (292 votes to 198). Amendment agreed to on question.

Secondary information

Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
487 c765-815;487 c765-816 
Session
2008-09
Department
Department for Children, Schools and Families
Chamber / Committee
House of Commons chamber
Proceeding contributions
Speaker | 487 c792 (Link to this contribution) Order. Perhaps I might venture to say that the matters that we are debating this evening are extreme...
Speaker | 487 c808 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady should withdraw that remark. That is fine—we all have to do that from time to time.
Show all contributions (129)
Tim Loughton | 487 c765 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move,"That this House is alarmed that nine years after the tragic death of Victoria Climbié...
Tim Loughton | 487 c768 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady is right; we have debated these issues on many occasions. In some of the Doncaster cas...
Meg Munn | 487 c768 (Link to this contribution) I know that the hon. Gentleman has taken an interest in this issue for some time, but when we cite s...
Tim Loughton | 487 c766-7 (Link to this contribution) I entirely agree with the hon. Lady, which is why I started my second paragraph by commending the gr...
Joan Humble | 487 c766 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman is rightly drawing attention to some horrific cases in which children died in dre...
John Hemming | 487 c768 (Link to this contribution) Does the hon. Gentleman share my concern that, notwithstanding a letter sent by the Secretary of Sta...
Tim Loughton | 487 c768 (Link to this contribution) I am afraid that the hon. Gentleman severely underestimates the purpose of this debate. This is not ...
Barry Sheerman | 487 c768 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman makes an important point, and we are all horrified by the baby P case, and any ca...
Speaker | 487 c765 (Link to this contribution) Order. We are just commencing this debate, so would hon. Members who do not wish to stay please leav...
Tim Loughton | 487 c765-6 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful for that, Madam Deputy Speaker. As I was saying, this topical subject requires urgent ...
Ed Balls | 487 c770 (Link to this contribution) In the letter of 18 November, which was sent before I made the statement to the House, I said:"““You...
Tim Loughton | 487 c770 (Link to this contribution) If anything I said is not true, I withdraw it. However, I distinctly remember the Secretary of State...
Meg Munn | 487 c771 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
Tim Loughton | 487 c770-1 (Link to this contribution) I have given way twice, which I think is generous. The Secretary of State will have ample opportunit...
Tim Loughton | 487 c771 (Link to this contribution) I want to make some progress, because many other hon. Members want to contribute.
John Hemming | 487 c768 (Link to this contribution) No, it has not. I am sorry, I mean that the Department has not provided that information and the Sec...
Tim Loughton | 487 c769 (Link to this contribution) I share the hon. Gentleman's concern, and I shall talk about serious case reviews shortly. I noticed...
Ed Balls | 487 c769-70 (Link to this contribution) May I correct a mistake made by the hon. Gentleman? At no time have I ever claimed that I asked the ...
Tim Loughton | 487 c774 (Link to this contribution) I will take my hon. Friend's intervention as the last one from this side of the House, just as I too...
Speaker | 487 c775 (Link to this contribution) Order. Again, the length of interventions is increasing as the time is going on.
Anthony Steen | 487 c774 (Link to this contribution) I am most grateful to my hon. Friend. First, the whole House must recognise that social workers have...
Tim Loughton | 487 c775-6 (Link to this contribution) I am trying to make progress, Madam Deputy Speaker, but my hon. Friend makes a very good point about...
Tim Loughton | 487 c776 (Link to this contribution) I ask the hon. Lady to bear with me. The commission on social workers strongly recommends that the h...
Tim Loughton | 487 c776-7 (Link to this contribution) I will not. It is also clear that the database is to be used for many more purposes than the child ...
Baroness Armstrong of Hill Top | 487 c777 (Link to this contribution) I really am shocked to hear what the hon. Gentleman says. He clearly has not investigated the databa...
Tim Loughton | 487 c777 (Link to this contribution) The answer to child protection problems in this country is not another expensive computer system tha...
Tim Loughton | 487 c777 (Link to this contribution) That shows that Labour Members yet again think that setting up, and ploughing money into, a computer...
Speaker | 487 c777 (Link to this contribution) Order. I ask that the debate be conducted in the proper manner; comments should not be made across t...
Tim Loughton | 487 c777 (Link to this contribution) I have not even finished responding to the previous intervention. What will protect children in thi...
John Hemming | 487 c780 (Link to this contribution) The Secretary of State stated that the number of deaths from child abuse and neglect had fallen shar...
Tim Loughton | 487 c778-9 (Link to this contribution) I will make some progress so that I can finish. I am grateful for the hard work and dedication of th...
Ed Balls | 487 c779-80 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move an amendment, to leave out from ““House”” to the end of the Question and add:"““agrees...
Tim Loughton | 487 c771 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady would be denying her own colleagues, of whom there are many, the opportunity to speak....
Tim Loughton | 487 c771 (Link to this contribution) I will let the Secretary of State respond in his speech when I have finished. He has had two opportu...
Lord Deben | 487 c772 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that it would be much easier for these devoted social workers to work if t...
Tim Loughton | 487 c772-3 (Link to this contribution) My right hon. Friend raises a very good point. It was a clear tenet of the Laming report that the bu...
Ed Balls | 487 c771 (Link to this contribution) I shall guarantee to take very seriously the advice of the National Society for the Prevention of Cr...
Tim Loughton | 487 c771-2 (Link to this contribution) It is also on the record that the NSPCC has sent round an e-mail clarifying its position, because it...
Speaker | 487 c773 (Link to this contribution) Order. The hon. Gentleman knows that interventions must be brief. I think that he has made his point...
Graham Stuart | 487 c773 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to my hon. Friend. I have here a copy of Hansard from 20 November 2008. The Secretary ...
Tim Loughton | 487 c774 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady was a social worker in a former existence and knows much of these matters, but I bet m...
Tim Loughton | 487 c773 (Link to this contribution) The right hon. Gentleman must stop chafing at the bit, as I am coming to the end of my speech and wa...
Meg Munn | 487 c774 (Link to this contribution) I thank the hon. Gentleman for his kindness, but I am extremely concerned when he throws around word...
Tim Loughton | 487 c773 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to my hon. Friend, but I shall give the Secretary of State the opportunity to clarify ...
Graham Stuart | 487 c784 (Link to this contribution) I am extremely grateful to the Secretary of State for giving way. May I take him back to the figures...
Ed Balls | 487 c784-5 (Link to this contribution) I hesitate to do this, but I will have to refer the hon. Gentleman back to the Hansard record of the...
Ed Balls | 487 c785 (Link to this contribution) I am happy to give way again, but can he please make a better intervention than his last one? We ans...
Graham Stuart | 487 c785 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the Secretary of State. I am afraid that it is he who needs to go back and read the...
Ed Balls | 487 c785-6 (Link to this contribution) I did that last time, and I explained the different basis for the figures. We are not disagreeing. T...
Meg Munn | 487 c786 (Link to this contribution) Is it not also the case that my right hon. Friend's Department initiates research into serious case ...
Ed Balls | 487 c786 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is right. That is why we publish those reviews. We have also said that executive summ...
Ed Balls | 487 c786-7 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful that the hon. Gentleman has come to the House to participate in this debate. Even thou...
Lord Gove | 487 c787 (Link to this contribution) On 20 November, the Secretary of State twice specifically cited the ruling of the Information Commis...
Lord Gove | 487 c786 (Link to this contribution) On the occasion of the Secretary of State's statement to this House, he mentioned the Information Co...
Ed Balls | 487 c788 (Link to this contribution) The detached observer would take seriously the views of the NSPCC and the deputy children's commissi...
John Hemming | 487 c788 (Link to this contribution) Will the right hon. Gentleman give way?
Ed Balls | 487 c787-8 (Link to this contribution) It would have been much better if the hon. Gentleman had decided to speak in this debate instead of ...
Paddy Tipping | 487 c788 (Link to this contribution) Does the Secretary of State agree that a detached observer listening to this part of the debate woul...
Ed Balls | 487 c789 (Link to this contribution) I know that there have been debates on these matters, and the Select Committee took a close interest...
Ed Balls | 487 c788 (Link to this contribution) In a second. My third point concerns the Opposition's call for all local safeguarding children board...
Annette Brooke | 487 c789 (Link to this contribution) On an earlier point concerning the review of Ofsted's inspection, does the Secretary of State agree ...
Ed Balls | 487 c781 (Link to this contribution) There is the political will, as I believe we showed in the case of Haringey. That was an exceptional...
Iain Duncan Smith | 487 c781 (Link to this contribution) The Secretary of State for Justice produced a report on care, which the right hon. Gentleman's offic...
Ed Balls | 487 c781 (Link to this contribution) The right hon. Gentleman is right. It is important that councils are called to account. This is not ...
Tim Loughton | 487 c781-2 (Link to this contribution) Before the Secretary of State moves away from the UN table that he quoted, will he make it clear to ...
Ed Balls | 487 c780-1 (Link to this contribution) The answer is that the UN figures show that over the past 15 years there has been a 40 per cent. fal...
John Hemming | 487 c781 (Link to this contribution) What are those figures, which we could then audit?
Ed Balls | 487 c781 (Link to this contribution) I am happy to quote the figures from the Office for National Statistics, which show that in 2003 the...
David Kidney | 487 c781 (Link to this contribution) I meet and listen to many children in care and people who have been in care, and they would remind t...
Bob Spink | 487 c782 (Link to this contribution) May I take the right hon. Gentleman back to the central issue of local authority performance? I firs...
Ed Balls | 487 c782 (Link to this contribution) I think I made it clear that UN figures are for child deaths, and they have fallen by 30 per cent. W...
Ed Balls | 487 c782 (Link to this contribution) I appreciate the hon. Gentleman's point, but as I said this is not a party political matter. The cou...
Ed Balls | 487 c783 (Link to this contribution) I am going to make a little progress. I shall refer to the issue of the publication of serious case ...
Madeleine Moon | 487 c783 (Link to this contribution) May I make an intervention on the specific issue of the courts?
Meg Munn | 487 c782 (Link to this contribution) May I return to the point made by the right hon. Member for Chingford and Woodford Green (Mr. Duncan...
Ed Balls | 487 c782-3 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend makes an important point in response to the right hon. Gentleman. Such decisions are ...
Ed Balls | 487 c783 (Link to this contribution) Of course that is the case. The hon. Member for East Worthing and Shoreham did not make the point, b...
Graham Stuart | 487 c798 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
Barry Sheerman | 487 c798-9 (Link to this contribution) I do not think I can allow another intervention. We must also learn from experience and from all th...
Graham Stuart | 487 c799-800 (Link to this contribution) It is a great pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Huddersfield (Mr. Sheerman), who is Chairman of...
Baroness Armstrong of Hill Top | 487 c800-2 (Link to this contribution) Too much of our child protection policy has been constructed following tragic cases. I am afraid tha...
Meg Munn | 487 c798 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that it is also important to give status to other people who work in child...
Rob Wilson | 487 c802-3 (Link to this contribution) Child protection is absolutely at the top of the agenda in my constituency and I want to take the op...
Meg Munn | 487 c803-5 (Link to this contribution) I shall deal with just three issues in my contribution. I want to speak about the importance of rais...
Baroness Featherstone | 487 c805-6 (Link to this contribution) When the Victoria Climbié tragedy happened in Haringey, the leadership took no fall for that. Only t...
Barry Sheerman | 487 c791 (Link to this contribution) On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. It is now 8.41 pm The hon. Member for East Worthing and Sho...
Barry Sheerman | 487 c797-8 (Link to this contribution) It is a pleasure to be given almost as long to speak in the Chamber as I was given on the ““Today”” ...
Annette Brooke | 487 c792-7 (Link to this contribution) In principle, I welcome the debate. It is important to hold a constructive discussion on child prote...
Speaker | 487 c792 (Link to this contribution) Order. In the light of my comments, we ought to move on. I call the Secretary of State.
Ed Balls | 487 c792 (Link to this contribution) I am happy to debate the issues at any time and at any length the Opposition choose, because they ar...
Speaker | 487 c808 (Link to this contribution) Order. We must not use intemperate language like that. Even a hint of a reference to misleading the ...
Maria Miller | 487 c808 (Link to this contribution) Thank you for that guidance, Mr. Speaker. Obviously what I really want the Minister to do is set the...
Maria Miller | 487 c807-8 (Link to this contribution) This debate has been an opportunity seriously to discuss the importance of child protection. It is r...
Baroness Hughes of Stretford | 487 c809-11 (Link to this contribution) I start by saying that I welcome the fact of this debate but regret the tone of it, which was set by...
Maria Miller | 487 c808-9 (Link to this contribution) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We all have a clear duty to do all that we can—[Interruption.] I am sorry, ...
Baroness Hughes of Stretford | 487 c811 (Link to this contribution) I am sorry; I am going to finish. I apologise to the hon. Gentleman. I implore Opposition Members t...
Ed Balls | 487 c790 (Link to this contribution) Of course I give way to the Chairman of the Children, Schools and Families Committee.
Barry Sheerman | 487 c790 (Link to this contribution) Will my right hon. Friend give way?
Ed Balls | 487 c790 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend's point is well made. I have already referred the letters that he mentions to Lord La...
Barry Sheerman | 487 c790 (Link to this contribution) The Secretary of State will know that I do not agree with some of the criticisms of data collection—...
Ed Balls | 487 c790-1 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend makes an important point, and ICS, well used, and ContactPoint are both valuable ways...
Parmjit Dhanda | 487 c790 (Link to this contribution) There is a danger that in discussing these matters, we sometimes become entirely focused on giving s...
Ed Balls | 487 c789 (Link to this contribution) In a second. I have two points to make in the time remaining to me. I completely agree that we need ...
John Hemming | 487 c789 (Link to this contribution) Will the Secretary of State give way?
Ed Balls | 487 c790 (Link to this contribution) Of course I will, and the British Association for Fostering and Adoption is part of that group, so w...
Speaker | 487 c792 (Link to this contribution) Order. Perhaps I might venture to say that the matters that we are debating this evening are extreme...
Tim Loughton | 487 c773 (Link to this contribution) I will give way first to my hon. Friend the Member for Beverley and Holderness (Mr. Stuart), and the...
Edward Timpson | 487 c806-7 (Link to this contribution) I preface my short contribution to the debate by re-emphasising that the issue requires genuine cros...
Edward Timpson | 487 c789 (Link to this contribution) Can the Secretary of State confirm that as part of the social work taskforce's activities, foster ca...
Tim Loughton | 487 c770 (Link to this contribution) The Secretary of State is very defensive. If this is such a big issue with him, why did he not seek ...
Tim Loughton | 487 c771 (Link to this contribution) I will willingly give way if the right hon. Gentleman will give that guarantee and undertaking to th...
Meg Munn | 487 c773 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
Ed Balls | 487 c783-4 (Link to this contribution) I shall make some progress and then take the hon. Gentleman's intervention. I said that I would tur...
Madeleine Moon | 487 c783 (Link to this contribution) I thank my right hon. Friend. In reference to court action, there have been criticisms that social w...
Barry Sheerman | 487 c798 (Link to this contribution) I absolutely agree with that point. I hope that the inquiry that the Secretary of State has set in ...
Speaker | 487 c791 (Link to this contribution) I understand the hon. Gentleman's frustration. I have been following the debate carefully, even when...
Subjects
Children Databases Children in care Abuse Bureaucracy ICT Inspections Protection Offences against children Standards Social services Vacancies Social workers Victoria Climbié Death Inquiry Ofsted
Contains statistics
Yes
Link
View this Parliamentary proceeding on www.publications.parliament.uk