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Debate on bill on Wednesday, 16 February 2011, in the House of Commons.

Parliamentary Voting System and Constituencies Bill

Parliamentary Voting System and Constituencies Bill. Consideration of Lords message relating to Lords amendments 1 and 8, proposing amendment (a) in lieu. Agreed on division (310 to 231).

Secondary information

Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
523 c1074-94 
Session
2010-12
Department
Cabinet Office
Legislative stage
Lords amendments
Chamber / Committee
House of Commons chamber
Related items
Proceeding contributions
Jacob Rees-Mogg | 523 c1088 (Link to this contribution) I am slightly troubled by my hon. Friend's remarks, because I was unaware that this had been put dow...
Lord Brennan of Canton | 523 c1087-8 (Link to this contribution) My right hon. Friend is right. I shall come to that point. The Minister is still trying to obfuscat...
Show all contributions (78)
Baroness Laing of Elderslie | 523 c1088 (Link to this contribution) The arguments of Lord Lamont and his colleagues in the other place are absolutely right, as was ever...
Lord Brennan of Canton | 523 c1087 (Link to this contribution) Like my hon. Friend the Member for Rhondda (Chris Bryant), I support AV and will vote yes in the ref...
Jack Straw | 523 c1087 (Link to this contribution) Picking up the point made by the hon. Member for Stone (Mr Cash), does my hon. Friend accept that th...
Richard Shepherd | 523 c1086-7 (Link to this contribution) I shall not, if the hon. Gentleman will forgive me. We have so little time and others want to speak....
David Winnick | 523 c1085-6 (Link to this contribution) I am not going to beat about the bush. I am not in favour of the change. I am not going to pretend I...
Richard Shepherd | 523 c1086 (Link to this contribution) The Government give as their reason for disagreeing:"““Because the outcome of the referendum should ...
Lord McCrea of Magherafelt and Cookstown | 523 c1089 (Link to this contribution) With the greatest respect to the hon. Lady, for whom I have great respect, I think that that is one ...
Baroness Laing of Elderslie | 523 c1088-9 (Link to this contribution) I appreciate my hon. Friend's intervention. It is not a confidence motion, but sadly it is for some ...
Stephen Williams | 523 c1085 (Link to this contribution) If we were at a different point in the electoral cycle, we could be having this referendum on the da...
Christopher Chope | 523 c1084 (Link to this contribution) Is the hon. Gentleman not at all concerned that, having listened to the arguments he deployed last n...
Stephen Williams | 523 c1084 (Link to this contribution) I thank the hon. Gentleman, who is my Political and Constitutional Reform Committee colleague, for t...
Jacob Rees-Mogg | 523 c1084 (Link to this contribution) In general elections the turnout is normally 70% or more. Is it right that that 70% of people should...
Angus Brendan MacNeil | 523 c1083 (Link to this contribution) The right hon. Gentleman referred to rigged referendums, but would a threshold not rig a referendum ...
Gerald Kaufman | 523 c1083 (Link to this contribution) I understand the hon. Gentleman's point, but I do not necessarily agree with him.
Paul Farrelly | 523 c1083-4 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Member for Stone (Mr Cash) quoted not the Member for Deauville, or even Trouville, but the ...
Gerald Kaufman | 523 c1084 (Link to this contribution) We do not know what the turnout will be on 5 May. What we do know, in my constituency, is that we wi...
Stephen Williams | 523 c1085 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman has made a lot of interventions, and other Members wish to get in. When an elect...
Baroness Laing of Elderslie | 523 c1089 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman is right; I do not disagree. He is right also about it being my saddest speech. I...
Lord McCrea of Magherafelt and Cookstown | 523 c1089-90 (Link to this contribution) The Prime Minister giving his word to the Deputy Prime Minister is one thing; what counts is the Pri...
Geoffrey Cox | 523 c1090 (Link to this contribution) We have but, I think, two minutes—[Interruption.] One minute. During the time in which this subject...
Ian Murray | 523 c1079 (Link to this contribution) One of the key arguments being made is that AV would mean that all Members of the House would have 5...
Chris Bryant | 523 c1079 (Link to this contribution) I believe my hon. Friend was in the Chamber yesterday when we had an interesting moment. The Ministe...
Lord Beith | 523 c1079 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
Chris Bryant | 523 c1079 (Link to this contribution) It is a particular irony for those who advocate the alternative vote, as I do, which in the majority...
David Winnick | 523 c1079 (Link to this contribution) Is it not the case that the amendment was originally carried by one vote in the Lords and was today ...
Chris Bryant | 523 c1079 (Link to this contribution) I will in a moment. I am still dealing with this question. I know that the hon. Member for Na h-Eile...
Dan Rogerson | 523 c1079 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
Chris Bryant | 523 c1078 (Link to this contribution) As I said yesterday—I know that I do not carry the whole House with this first sentence, but perhaps...
Lord Harper | 523 c1077 (Link to this contribution) I am just going to deal with the point the hon. Gentleman raised earlier. I am asking hon. Members o...
Chris Bryant | 523 c1078 (Link to this contribution) I am afraid that I have been asking the Minister to provide clear definitions and clarity for some t...
Paul Farrelly | 523 c1078 (Link to this contribution) Just before the Minister summarily sat down, he said that if there were a clear decision, it would b...
Chris Bryant | 523 c1078 (Link to this contribution) I will give way in a moment. Of course we do not expect there to be only 10% or 15% voting in electi...
Chris Bryant | 523 c1081 (Link to this contribution) My right hon. Friend is absolutely right. In addition, the Liberal Democrats and the Conservatives s...
Bernard Jenkin | 523 c1082 (Link to this contribution) Can we dispense with this argument that any kind of threshold somehow provides an incentive for the ...
William Cash | 523 c1081-2 (Link to this contribution) I entirely endorse the final remarks of the hon. Member for Rhondda (Chris Bryant)—the Government am...
Gerald Kaufman | 523 c1082-3 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Member for Harwich and North Essex (Mr Jenkin), who intervened a few moments ago, is of cou...
William Cash | 523 c1082 (Link to this contribution) I agree with my hon. Friend and point out that no European country other than France does not have a...
Gerald Kaufman | 523 c1083 (Link to this contribution) I will give way in a moment, but I want to proceed on this point. When I was shadow Home Secretary,...
Gerald Kaufman | 523 c1083 (Link to this contribution) I will give way in a moment, but I want to complete this segment of my argument, taking into account...
Lord Beith | 523 c1079 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful. If the hon. Gentleman loses the vote in the Commons tonight, does he think the unelec...
Chris Bryant | 523 c1079 (Link to this contribution) I will give way to the right hon. Member for Berwick-upon-Tweed (Sir Alan Beith) first, because he a...
Angus Brendan MacNeil | 523 c1080 (Link to this contribution) Surely if a threshold is in place, it is an incentive not to participate. I hope that the Labour Fro...
Chris Bryant | 523 c1079-80 (Link to this contribution) As the right hon. Gentleman knows, I have advocated an elected House of Lords for a very long time, ...
Jack Straw | 523 c1081 (Link to this contribution) I apologise that I was not here at the commencement of these proceedings—I got caught short in the g...
Chris Bryant | 523 c1080 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is, as always, spot on, and I will come to the Government amendment in lieu after I h...
Lord Brennan of Canton | 523 c1080 (Link to this contribution) To return to the amendment in lieu that the Minister has proposed, does my hon. Friend agree that it...
Chris Bryant | 523 c1080 (Link to this contribution) I knew the hon. Gentleman was going to make a silly point, because he made the same silly point earl...
Lord Harper | 523 c1076 (Link to this contribution) Our system does not have a minimum turnout threshold for elections and we do not have a tradition of...
Lord Harper | 523 c1076 (Link to this contribution) I have already given way to the hon. Gentleman and I am going to make some progress. There are some...
Lord Harper | 523 c1077 (Link to this contribution) I am not going to give way to the hon. Gentleman. I know that some Members favour this Lords amendm...
Lord Harper | 523 c1076 (Link to this contribution) Once was enough. Let me make some progress.
Speaker | 523 c1076 (Link to this contribution) Order. Mr Brennan, the Minister has given way once and he has said that he is not going to give way ...
Lord Harper | 523 c1076 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to you, Mr Deputy Speaker. A related point made in the other place was the argument t...
Geoffrey Cox | 523 c1076 (Link to this contribution) What is meant by ““the people””? Is there any size of turnout that the Minister would regard as not ...
Bernard Jenkin | 523 c1077 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend not recognise that there is a difference between an ordinary election and consti...
Lord Harper | 523 c1077 (Link to this contribution) I have two points to make. First, on my hon. Friend's last point, we are talking about a national re...
Lord Harper | 523 c1077 (Link to this contribution) I am not going to give way. The key arguments against the threshold remain as compelling as ever. I...
Lord Harper | 523 c1074 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move that this House insists on its disagreement with the Lords in their amendments 1 and 8...
Speaker | 523 c1074 (Link to this contribution) A message has been received from the Lords on the Parliamentary Voting System and Constituencies Bil...
Lord Harper | 523 c1076 (Link to this contribution) I have already given way to the hon. Gentleman.
Lord Harper | 523 c1076 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman makes a good point, because the threshold sets up an incentive for one side to ca...
Angus Brendan MacNeil | 523 c1075 (Link to this contribution) Is not one of the problems with their lordships' threshold that it invalidates only one of the optio...
Lord Harper | 523 c1075 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful for my hon. Friend's support. I am sure that her clarion call will be heard at the oth...
Baroness Laing of Elderslie | 523 c1075 (Link to this contribution) The Minister has just referred to two occasions on which the House has debated thresholds. Both time...
William Cash | 523 c1075 (Link to this contribution) Having studied the amendment, I trust that the Minister will not spend another 25 to 30 minutes goin...
Lord Harper | 523 c1075 (Link to this contribution) If my hon. Friend will allow me, I will make some progress. The House of Lords has now asked us to ...
Lord Brennan of Canton | 523 c1074 (Link to this contribution) I understand the Minister's point about the technical reasons for the Government's amendment, but do...
Lord Harper | 523 c1074 (Link to this contribution) If the hon. Gentleman will allow me, I will give the details as I proceed with my speech. If he does...
Stephen Williams | 523 c1084 (Link to this contribution) This is an extraordinary occasion in that the unelected House of Parliament is, with absolutely no s...
Subjects
Alternative vote Referendums Voting behaviour
Legislation
Parliamentary Voting System and Constituencies Bill 2010-12
Link
View this Parliamentary proceeding on www.publications.parliament.uk