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Science and Technology

My Lords, I thank all noble Lords who have taken part in the debate and I am glad to see my noble friend Lord Sainsbury back at the Dispatch Box. My noble friend is more sceptical than I about our situation. When people talk about the need for more ““Britishness”” in our laboratories and so on, they should go to the majority of the laboratories and universities in America, where it is like the United Nations. That is what we want here. We need to ease the way in which we recruit people and ease the regulatory framework under which we give them passports so that we can attract them to this country to fill up our laboratories. It is the only way in which we can get vibrancy into our research system. I agree with what my noble friend said about animal right activists. The noble Lord, Lord Taverne, spoke of his concern about the Government’s regulation of science. I agree with my noble friend Lord Sainsbury that if we enter into it at a fairly early stage our regulations are more likely to be right than wrong. But, of course, we have had some bad ones. The noble Lord, Lord May, is always brilliant when he speaks. He is a mathematician and, therefore, he is always precise. I was a member of the Council for Science and Technology when he was the Chief Scientific Adviser and every meeting we had was brilliant. He sometimes lost his temper, but he was always right. In this debate he has articulated that a direct link between basic research and productivity is always very difficult to achieve; that to correlate indirectly is the right thing to do. In Britain, the standard of living and the quality of life that we have can be directly and indirectly attributed to our basic science. I could give many examples of where basic science could be directly correlated but, by and large, most of it is indirect. This is for the public good, and the noble Lord, more than anyone else, articulates it very well. The noble Baroness, Lady Morgan, referred to the results of cancer research and the need for speeding up the entry of women into SET. I agree. But I am sure that everyone knows—there are articles in the newspapers about it every day—that our cancer research is second to none. I should say to my noble friend Lord Soley that if he could develop a world-class science hospital in the Imperial College it would be brilliant. I am sure our noble friend Lord Sainsbury will help him. My noble friend Lord Haskel said something about a subject that is very close to my heart because, more often than not, it is not only the technology developed in this country that is important. For our businesses to be competitive and productive, we should harness and exploit technology wherever it is developed. Although people always criticise that the transfer of pure science into the market place in this country has been poor, by and large, as the noble Baroness, Lady Sharp, mentioned, 92 per cent of all development and research takes place in the outside world. The reason for the Asians doing well is that they have a skilled, literate workforce which articulates and implements its knowledge base because it is hungry for it. We can also do that. This is the issue to which my noble friend Lord Haskel referred. The situation is improving enormously. Many, many companies which never used to have graduates now have graduates and science graduates. My noble friend Lord Hunt referred to the problems of demonstrator projects—effectively that is what he was talking about—in America. Although we realise that Americans do not subsidise their companies, their demonstrator projects—especially funded by DAPRA and various other organisations—are huge. Let me give an example. They gave $2 million towards developing robots that could travel for 212 kilometres in the desert. Two years ago, they could do only 12 kilometres; this year five reached the target. The compact engine produced by the American automotive industry was developed through demonstrator projects. We in this country should look seriously at developing demonstrator projects jointly with industry and the universities. My noble friend Lord Turnberg spoke about medical research. We know that this country’s contribution to medical research is second to none, and everyone acknowledges that. Any youngster who wishes to study science today—including the biological sciences and other exciting sciences—can do so in our universities. Hence intakes in those subjects—at least at my university—have increased enormously. Finally, I must thank my noble friend Lord Sainsbury, who is passionate about R&D. Where else would you find a grocer being passionate about an area of science and technology, and being passionate about delivering it to ensure that this country remains on top? I thank all noble Lords and I beg leave to withdraw the Motion for Papers. Motion for Papers, by leave, withdrawn.