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Transport (Wales) Bill

My Lords, unlike the noble Lord, Lord Roberts of Conwy, and the noble Lord, Lord Bradshaw, who have just spoken, I bring no expert knowledge or insight to the discussion this evening. I therefore hope that it is not presumptuous for me to add a word of warm welcome to the Bill and my appreciation of the hard work that has been put into its preparation by the men and women of the Assembly and the team of civil servants in both Cardiff and London over the past five years. I understand that it is a Bill that has commanded almost universal acclaim in Wales. I must hasten to add that like the noble Lord, Lord Roberts of Conwy, and other noble Lords, I too have received this evening the letter from the Very Reverend Archimandrite Father Deiniol from Blaenau Ffestiniog in Gwynedd. He argues powerfully that unless the Bill is extended to include certain aspects of rail transport it will give us something less than a properly integrated transport system in Wales. I am grateful to my noble friend Lord Evans for having related the Bill’s long history and the scrutiny of the draft Bill. However, I note that the Assembly’s Economic Development and Transport Committee in its report dated July 2004 drew attention to what it described as the,"““extremely short time available for this scrutiny of the draft Bill””." Those words can be found on page 10 of the report. I hope and trust that the UK Government will take account of that message. The Bill represents an important contribution to economic and social development, but for many people it is also welcome for the opportunity it may offer to promote environmental sustainability, which everybody agrees is essential. How likely is that to come about? I shall dwell on that question for a minute or two. The term ““sustainability”” is embedded among four other adjectives in Clause 1(1)(a) yet we know that there is an existing overriding duty on the Assembly to make a sustainable development scheme that will apply to all its functions and relate to all its fields. That duty is to be found in Section 121 of the Government of Wales Act 1998. I have always thought that that provision has considerable potential, although nowhere in the 1998 Act or in the Bill have I seen a definition of the meaning of the word ““sustainable””. Given the existing duty in Section 121, and notwithstanding what is said on this matter in the report on the draft Bill published in July 2004, I am somewhat puzzled as to the significance of the appearance of the word ““sustainable”” in Clause 1(1)(a). Can my noble friend confirm whether it adds anything to, or is different from, the duty in Section 121? It seems to me that the position remains the same and is untouched. According to what I have heard, there is some concern in some quarters that the sustainable development scheme has not worked as well as was hoped in 1998. Is there any sound basis for such concern? Can the Minister tell the House how much progress has been made by the Assembly in achieving sustainable development? I appreciate that the Minister may not be in a position to deal with that question tonight and may prefer to respond to it in writing. Turning to the future, is the Minister able to indicate whether the Wales transport strategy, to which he referred, will set out the environmental quality to be achieved over the next 10 or 15 years? What will the target be? How radical will the vision be? I use the word ““vision”” because the Economic Development and Transport Committee refers to its vision for public transport in Wales. The Bill goes on to arm the Assembly with a mechanism for implementing the transport strategy. Is the Minister in a position to give some clearer idea to the House of whether it will require funding in addition to the £8 billion to be made available over the next 15 years that was announced a year ago by Andrew Davies, the Assembly’s Minister for Economic Affairs? Has that money been ringfenced? Indeed, does the Assembly know today—is it possible for any government to know—how much money will be required to implement a transport policy effectively over the next 10 or 15 years in a fast changing world? From what is known, will £8 billion be enough? It usually never is. Will any additional funding that may well be necessary be made available by the Assembly? I have only one more question for the Minister. We are well aware that there are huge tasks ahead for the National Assembly for Wales during the next few years. For my part, I would not underrate the difficulties that may lie ahead. It is that that induces me to ask whether the Assembly has the essential human resources in order to cope with the immediate implementation of the Bill and of the Government of Wales Bill, on which Ministers and officials in London and Cardiff are working very hard. That is my last question, but finally I offer one comment on the historical significance of the Bill. We have never before had a Transport (Wales) Bill and in the long history of your Lordships’ House since it became a second Chamber, it has never before, as far as I can see, had two Wales-only Bills before it at the same time. I suggest that this is evidence that the old order changeth, and none too soon for Wales, thanks to the momentum of devolution and the Government of Wales Act 1998.