---

Education and Inspections Bill

My Lords, I think that the feeling of the House may be that we should move to a conclusion, so I venture to make my contribution to this very important set of amendments. Not for the first time, I very much agree with the common sense of the noble Baroness, Lady Richardson. I thank the noble Lord, Lord Baker, for his efforts to do something about an issue that is of great concern to us all. If I do not support his amendment, it is not because I do not agree with many of his words about the benefits of inclusion. I salute his expertise and agree with much of what he said about not dividing children on a religious basis at the age of five, but where we differ is on how best to do it. We believe social integration and tolerance and understanding between the different social, cultural and religious groups in this country to be one of the most important challenges we face—not just for the sake of peace and tackling terrorism, but for the more positive objective of enriching all our lives. However, faith schools and the contribution that they could make to that desirable understanding and integration are only part of the picture. We believe that schools should serve, and be accountable to, communities. We are not happy with artificial quotas because they generate artificial situations, encourage gerrymandering of admission arrangements and the possibility of bussing children long distances to school unnecessarily, and they have many other practical difficulties. Unfortunately, today we have both voluntary and involuntary postcode segregation. There is voluntary segregation because people choose to live in certain places because of the quality and composition of the schools, and they choose to move away from other areas for the same reason. There is involuntary segregation because some people are forced to remain in areas where the schools do not satisfy them and they cannot afford to move elsewhere. I do not believe, therefore, that we should be addressing this very serious matter at this stage of a Bill which is essentially about something else. Instead, we should take a holistic look at the picture of social and cultural segregation and address all the factors that affect it. We should be doing that on a cross-party basis. I know that all parties would take part most enthusiastically in such an exercise. I say to the noble Lord, Lord Dearing, that I am sure that the Muslim community would do so, too. I think that it would satisfy some of the noble Lord’s concerns if perhaps we had a special commission or royal commission on this subject. It is a great pity that Ruth Kelly’s commission on social integration is not allowed to look at any barriers that faith schools might put in the way of real understanding and co-operation between the many groups that live in this country and the very positive contribution that they could make to improve the situation if they were genuinely integrated. I am afraid I do not believe that the amendment tabled by the noble Lord, Lord Baker, would achieve very much. We are living in a climate where school rolls are falling. The number of genuinely new schools will be small. I understand that in proposed subsection (2) of the amendment the noble Lord has specifically excluded Muslim schools that are currently private but are planning to come into the maintained sector. It would be desirable for such schools to be caught up by his amendment, were it to be practicable, and also that they should deliver the national curriculum, including the information about other religions that we find in the RE curriculum. However, I do not think that the noble Lord’s amendment is practicable and workable. One might say that it does not go far enough. It is not unreasonable for one to suggest that, if the community or the state is paying for the school, 100 per cent of its places should be available for any young citizen of that state. But I should like to ask the noble Lord what he thinks should be done if a school cannot attract 25 per cent of pupils who are not of the faith. Surely he would not want to drive a coach and horses through the parental choice agenda by coercing parents in any way to send their children to these schools. The alternative is that they do not set up at all. That may well be his objective, but what will he do about parents who want such a school? Does he prefer them to have a private school, which is not subject to Ofsted and does not deliver the national curriculum? A royal commission or some sort of cross-party commission would give all parties an opportunity to have a voice in this debate. It is a matter far too complex to be resolved by a relatively simple amendment, even one proposed by the noble Lord. I understand that the Government intend to table an amendment at Third Reading to allow for a process of appeal to the Secretary of State if the admission arrangements of a new school look as though they will produce less than 25 per cent non-faith pupils. Of course, we will look carefully at the exact wording of that amendment when it comes before us and make up our minds then about whether to support it. But, for the moment, before I have had the opportunity of hearing what the Minister has to say, there are many serious questions to ask—not least, how long would a ruling about 25 per cent non-faith pupils on the school roll last? Would it be for the first year of the establishment of the school, or for three years or five? What would happen if a few pupils left and the school roll fell below the 25 per cent level? Would it have to close? The bottom line is that these problems will occur unless the school wants to educate a range of faiths within its ranks and unless parents want their children to go there. Parents will want that if they are convinced of two things: the first is that the child will get a good education; the second is that the child will enjoy and benefit from mixing with a wide range of children from different cultural and religious groups and have the opportunity to get to know children of different backgrounds and make friends with them. People rarely kill their friends. They do not usually bomb people whom they know, like and understand. I make it clear that this comment does not imply that I think that faith schools have any responsibility for terrorism. It simply means that I think that they could make a valuable contribution to preventing it if they were integrated and promoted understanding. That is what we need to achieve, but I do not believe that the amendment in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Baker, will do it and I have severe reservations about whether the expected government amendment will do it either. However, I wait to see. I turn to government Amendment No. 79 and the new set of amendments from the noble Baroness, Lady Turner, and others on my own Back Benches. I thank the Minister for accepting the principle of the amendment I tabled in Committee to allow older pupils to exempt themselves from collective worship if they wish. I say to my noble friend Lord Avebury that that is all I ask for, rather than them having to rely on their parents to do it for them. I believe that is only right; it is their human right. I am still a little concerned that we have to rely on the funding agreement to make it apply to academies, but I shall keep a close eye on that. I was very interested to read the report of the JCHR, published last Friday, which suggests that the Government should go further if they wish to fulfil a child’s rights under Article 9 of the human rights convention. The noble Baroness, Lady Turner, and my noble friends clearly agree with them, as they have laid Amendments Nos. 79A to 79K. Perhaps I should explain why I do not support that group of amendments. In the climate that I described earlier, where we have postcode segregation and where many maintained schools are 98 per cent of one faith and culture, the national curriculum religious education course is very important. It is really the only way in which some children learn about other religions. Until we sort out that situation I do not think that we should encourage children to remove themselves from religious education. Religious education is different from religious instruction and indoctrination and, as I understand it, it is taught in a comparative-religion way in most schools. Worship is quite different.