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Postal Services Bill [HL]

My Lords, I agree with the noble Lord, Lord Fowler. If the Bill had been brought forward by the last Tory Government or any other Tory Government, the Labour Party would be jumping up and down in rage. It would be organising marches up and down the country and there would be a huge lobby of Parliament against the Bill. I do not agree with the Bill. It is unnecessary and should not have been brought forward. However, I suppose that, because it is not a Tory Bill but a Labour Bill, it must be all right. I do not think so. I shall tell your Lordships in the time available why it is not the sort of thing that should be brought forward by a Labour Government. I remind the House, and noble Lords who have already spoken, that the noble Lord, Lord Hunt, said from the Tory Front Bench that he will march shoulder to shoulder with the Secretary of State for the Bill in the Lobbies this evening. However, he also warned that the Conservatives will table amendments in Committee and on Report. I warn Labour Lords that this is a House of Lords Bill. Any amendments made here can be altered in the House of Commons but cannot be overturned by the Parliament Act because this is a House of Lords Bill. Therefore, noble Lords should be careful about supporting the Bill and consider supporting the amendment so admirably moved by the noble Lord, Lord Clarke. The Bill has something to do with the European Union. The Amsterdam treaty lays down that any state aid provided to a commercial organisation must be approved by the EU Commission. Therefore, a decision to subsidise the Post Office and the Royal Mail is not entirely in our hands. Postal services directive 97/67/EC, agreed in 1997, and subsequent directives are creating a single internal market for postal services in the EU, and all services must be opened up to competition. That is part of the basis of this Bill. I do not wish to dwell on the EU aspect at the moment, but we have the Bill largely because of EU directives. One of my major reasons for opposing the Bill is the proposal to sell off 30 per cent of the business. I do not see why that is necessary, as I shall explain later. I want to know how much the Secretary of State thinks that he will get. How much money will the 30 per cent bring in? What will happen to it when it is brought in? Will it be put into the postal services, or into Royal Mail, or will it bail out bankers? We want to know where that money will go. As regards introducing new management to bring about change and modernisation, was that not the reason for employing Allan Leighton and Adam Crozier as chairman and chief executive? Were they not supposed to have put things right? It does not seem to have worked because we have the Bill. I do not think that their backgrounds in grocery, chocolate, football, pet foods, newspaper sales and Saatchi & Saatchi equipped them for the job. In my view, other people with much better experience could have run the service a lot better. Who will run the service next? We know that TNT is the favourite foreign firm to come in. Will it run the service? Who will run the service? Usually, the Government want to bring in people with financial or banking experience. Surely, they will not allow those people to run the Post Office, bearing in mind that they have brought the world almost to financial and economic destruction. Who will they bring in to run the Royal Mail? The Royal Mail should be led by people who know the industry, have worked in it and have leadership skills. Those are the best people to run the industry. I should have thought that Labour Lords in particular would agree with that. However, I guess that is not going to happen. I really cannot believe that these people do not already exist in the Royal Mail. I think that they are there, and I hope that they will be the next people to run the service. There should be no need to bring in people from a foreign mail carrier. The sell-off of 30 per cent of the business is the thin end of the wedge. The Secretary of State will not be able to give the assurance that that will not eventually lead to full nationalisation.