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Pensions Bill

I thank all noble Lords who have spoken. Everyone has strongly supported the amendment apart from the Government and the Official Opposition Front Bench. If anything, the person who chided me slightly was my noble friend Lord Jones, who suggested, in a very moving speech, that I should have gone further, but we on these Benches can only go as far as we feel is affordable at this stage. However, at least we are putting forward a clear and, as the figures given by the Minister made clear, eminently affordable proposal. We think that £30 million or £35 million a year is a very modest start and it would recognise the injustice that exists. The noble Baroness talked about people having worked and built up their entitlement to a pension in the UK. Is that not an entitlement to a pension in the same form as that received by people who have not left? An entitlement to a pension which is halved or more than halved over a period by inflation and by being frozen does not seem to be the same as an entitlement to a pension built up by working in the UK. With regard to the points that my noble friend made about overseas territories, I honestly did not feel that the Minister addressed the fact that there is no one to negotiate a reciprocal agreement on behalf of these few hundred people. It is not right to compare the situation with that of former colonies from years ago, because those colonies now each have their own Government and, if they wished to negotiate a reciprocal arrangement, as some of them have done, they could do so. However, as the noble Baroness pointed out—I shall read her speech carefully—that would not be possible or appropriate in the case of the overseas territories. Therefore, these poor people are completely and utterly stuck and I think that, in a way, she made my noble friend’s case for him. I hope that the noble Baroness will specifically undertake to give my noble friend the figures that he asked for on uprating the pensions of 80 and75 year-olds. It struck me that it was perfectly reasonable to ask for that and I hope that she will be able to supply the information before Report. As I said, we believe that we have made a very modest and affordable proposal. We shall certainly return to this matter at later stages of the Bill but, for now, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment. Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.