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Child Maintenance and Other Payments Bill

I cannot say that I was interrupted in full flood because I speak somewhat slowly, but perhaps I may use the expression ““full exudation””. I was saying that CMEC will have the same staff, the same computer system and the same CSO as the CSA. The Minister needs to convince us that it really will be different in practice, which I am afraid—so far as I am concerned, anyway—he has not achieved so far. One of the things that appears to be different now is that the Henshaw report—which is probably the point at which I left my remarks—envisaged quite large-scale contracting out of some of CMEC’s services. From what I have been reading as background to the Bill, Stephen Geraghty believes that is unlikely to happen, as he told the Select Committee of another place recently. Is it right that a body with net operating costs of more than £500 million in public money, dealing with around 2 million customers in a very sensitive area of policy, currently handling more than £6 billion in annual receipts and likely to be engaged in robust enforcement action, should have considerable autonomy from Ministers in its operating practice and policy? I heard the Minister, in response to one of the questions I put under the previous amendment, saying that in effect there was no difference between a non-departmental public agency and the procedure originally proposed in the Bill. I hope I have got that right. I am finding this difficult to grasp.