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Employment Bill [HL]

I agree with the noble Lord, Lord Campbell of Alloway. We often agree on issues. He has told me that he has represented trade unions in many cases, so he is speaking from experience. I know that the noble Lord, Lord Lester, is trying to achieve a balance. We all want to achieve a balance that is fair on both sides. I say to the noble Lord, Lord Lester, that a trade union could not have anything to do with the terms and conditions of employment—he said it could go behind the scenes and get rid of them. However, if a judgment was based on that, the other side could not guarantee that that had not happened. Is the noble Lord taking the right approach? I ask him, with all his legal experience, whether there is any way that the union could influence the terms and conditions of employment, which are a matter for the employer rather than the union?