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Digital Economy Bill [HL]

That is merely intended to cover wider economic considerations—no more than that—so I do not depart from what I have already said about Amendment 81. We are all agreed that any decision to introduce technical measures is not to be taken lightly and that Parliament should play a part in the process. We have accepted that there should be a gradual approach and an educative approach. However, I cannot accept my noble friend’s proposal, even though he wanted to do it his way, as he said. I do not think that Amendment 83 is the right way of delivering that scrutiny, for two reasons: first, we are having a full debate now as part of the scrutiny of this primary legislation; and, secondly, we have provided that the order will be considered under the affirmative procedure, which means that there will be further parliamentary debate on any order if and when technical obligations are proposed. We have said that we expect that our initial obligations, allied with education and new business models, should bring about a significant reduction in copyright infringement, which I know my noble friend desires. However, because we cannot be sure of that, we believe that including a reserve power on technical measures is necessary. The debate has been about whether the process and procedure by which we might use that reserve power is stringent enough and has sufficient safeguards. We have listened to and understood the concerns and we have added these extra significant safeguards. The super-affirmative procedure is appropriate in the particular circumstances of Clause 17, but in this situation all that the super-affirmative procedure would achieve is further delay. I therefore ask my noble friend not to press his amendment. The effect of removing the text that Amendment 84 proposes should be deleted would be to remove the clarity in the Bill that the Secretary of State has the power to set criteria for taking technical measures. I am not sure whether the intent of the amendment is to remove what my noble friend Lord Whitty may regard as extraneous language, but I suggest that it is sensible to make it clear in the Bill that we anticipate that the order will contain specific criteria within which technical measures would operate. I reassure the noble Baroness, Lady Miller, that we have no intention of withdrawing people’s internet access. That would only be at the end of a long process. We feel confident that most people will respond when they are advised that what they are doing is illegal and would take steps to remedy the situation. We are not talking about removing people’s internet access on a whim. I should add that government Amendment 82 changes new Section 124H(1)(a) in Clause 11 so that the Secretary of State must take into account any Ofcom assessment and report and any other matter that he considers relevant. The noble Earl, Lord Erroll, talked about people who use Voice over Internet Protocol and do not have a landline. There may be such people, but I suggest that they would more than likely possess a mobile telephone. I see the noble Earl nodding. I do not think that we are casting them into the outer darkness of being unable to communicate. I take his point about the changing nature of people’s requirements with regard to telecommunications, but I have yet to encounter a person using VOIP who does not have a mobile phone. Maybe someone is out there, but I have not met them. We understand the concerns. Moving to technical measures is a serious step, but we will not take it without having gone through the initial obligations, such as the educative and warning processes, ensuring that Ofcom issues progress reports and has to take into account exactly what is happening. With those assurances, I trust that my noble friend will feel able to withdraw the amendment.