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Digital Economy Bill [HL]

My Lords, I will certainly not press Amendment 81, but I ask the Minister to look at the points made by the noble Earl, Lord Erroll. My understanding is the same as his: that the amendment to Clause 10 does indeed qualify some of the activities that follow. But I am not utterly convinced—and neither is the noble Earl—that it covers all of them. It is a technical point that can be easily clarified. Likewise, on Amendment 84, it is probably true that the noble Lord’s amendments ameliorate Clause 11 and I will not therefore press that either. However, Amendment 83 covers an area that embodies the anxieties expressed in a wide range of interventions in the House at various points in the Bill. The move from stage 1 to stage 2 is an important step. If Clause 13 and subsequent clauses remain as drafted, it is a step that will be decided simply by an administrative tribunal not a court. It can involve, as noble Lords have stressed at earlier points, pretty substantial detriment to the subscriber. The subscriber may not actually be the perpetrator, but their home and business or institution could be completely cut off, at least temporarily, from access to the internet. Those are substantial penalties. The need to move into that territory deserves serious parliamentary consideration. It may be that the process outlined here is not entirely appropriate, but it should involve something more than affirmative resolution. The first paragraph of Amendment 83 introduces the need for explanatory documentation, which should be a little more than the notes that occasionally accompany affirmative orders. There should be a debate in both Houses of Parliament—as required by an affirmative order—but one that allows Parliament to recognise that this is a serious step and a serious escalation of the process. Although I will not divide the House at this point, I will reconsider the issue in the light of any amendments that are made to Clause 13 and associated clauses. However, I suspect that I will ask the Government to return to this. The credibility of the process in this House and among subscribers and others outside will depend on whether we have a controlled process. Do we have a process that takes account of progress towards convincing users of the desirability of moving to lawful systems? Do lawful systems exist to the extent that they are usable—in terms of price, availability and flexibility? In other words, is progress to the desired goal of moving to lawful systems in sight of being achieved or has technology overtaken us, making it less likely to be achieved? The problem of unlawful file-sharing may escalate in that period and therefore these measures, in their full force, will be necessary. We do not know what the outcome of that will be in 18 months-plus time, and we need a position to reconsider. The noble Lord said that this would slow it down. Well, yes, it would with regard to the timing and preparation for a debate in this House, but such a serious step deserves the time of this House and its ability to make a difference to what whichever Government are then in power decide to do about this clause. Whoever aspires to be in government at that stage, one would expect quite a serious political reaction to moving down this road; it would be wise for any Government to get a clear and positive endorsement from Parliament before they did so. For the moment, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment. Amendment 81 withdrawn. Amendment 82 Moved by