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Adjournment debate on Thursday, 26 April 2007, in the House of Commons, led by Adam Ingram. The answering member was Liam Fox.

Defence in the UK

Debate on a motion for the adjournment on defence in the UK.

Secondary information

Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
459 c1050-135 
Session
2006-07
Department
Ministry of Defence
Chamber / Committee
House of Commons chamber
Proceeding contributions
Mike Penning | 459 c1053 (Link to this contribution) It was done under this Government.
Lord Lancaster of Kimbolton | 459 c1053 (Link to this contribution) I accept what the Minister is saying, but may I ask for a degree of flexibility in budgets? I accept...
Show all contributions (132)
Adam Ingram | 459 c1053-4 (Link to this contribution) I do not disagree with the hon. Gentleman. We need to take a hard look at this, because I do not thi...
Liam Fox | 459 c1054 (Link to this contribution) The Minister is absolutely right to say that a military environment is far the best environment for ...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1052-3 (Link to this contribution) I may not get beyond page three of my speech if I accept every intervention on the quality of existi...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1050 (Link to this contribution) I welcome this opportunity to debate defence in the United Kingdom. I know that the House will echo ...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1060-1 (Link to this contribution) No, I want to make progress. I cannot comment on the contribution of defence to this country withou...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1063 (Link to this contribution) I agree with the hon. Gentleman’s general sentiment and we are aware of the problem. Indeed, efforts...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1061 (Link to this contribution) As well as the equipment provided to personnel, the quality of the medical support in the field is i...
Liam Fox | 459 c1061 (Link to this contribution) I begin by echoing the Minister’s words about the sadness that is felt in all parts of the House con...
Liam Fox | 459 c1061-2 (Link to this contribution) Indeed. I have witnessed that and I commend the professionalism of those involved—some of whom have ...
Liam Fox | 459 c1058 (Link to this contribution) I wish to ask a question before the Minister moves on from inquests. As he knows, a large amount of ...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1058 (Link to this contribution) I shall give way to the hon. Gentleman.
Adam Ingram | 459 c1057 (Link to this contribution) I could ask, ““What do we all intend to do about it?? There is an issue: clearly, we have a particul...
Liam Fox | 459 c1063 (Link to this contribution) My right hon. Friend is correct and has saved me from making that exact point. The issue cuts across...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1053 (Link to this contribution) I will not engage in a debate about the apportioning of blame. The hon. Gentleman asked whether we c...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1054-5 (Link to this contribution) Yes. We are thinking about how such a facility could best be delivered. It is definitely ruled in, n...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1056 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman raises two important points. He is right in what he says about the pre-selection ...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1053 (Link to this contribution) I think it has been recognised that it was a fundamental mistake to sell off all the housing.
Mike Penning | 459 c1053 (Link to this contribution) Can we learn from the mistakes of past Governments as well as the present Government? We should thin...
Tony Baldry | 459 c1051 (Link to this contribution) When does the Minister envisage bringing back the British Army on the Rhine, given the extra costs o...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1051 (Link to this contribution) I think that the hon. Gentleman knows that we are considering Lyneham, and a number of options, and ...
Dari Taylor | 459 c1051 (Link to this contribution) I feel obliged to get involved in this debate about new training facilities, as it is an important o...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1051 (Link to this contribution) As the Under-Secretary of State for Defence, my hon. Friend the Member for Halton (Derek Twigg) says...
James Gray | 459 c1051 (Link to this contribution) The Minister is right that the super garrisons must be based near the best possible training facilit...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1059-60 (Link to this contribution) I thought that that question, which contained a barb about aircraft carriers, was going to be helpfu...
Liam Fox | 459 c1062-3 (Link to this contribution) As I have just said, I welcome the efforts that the Government are making. Indeed, I have visited so...
Liam Fox | 459 c1063 (Link to this contribution) I am not sure that that is what needs to be done. It would be easy, in the system of maximum waiting...
Linda Gilroy | 459 c1062 (Link to this contribution) Does the hon. Gentleman welcome the fact, as I do, that the MOD is exceeding its improvement targets...
Tony Baldry | 459 c1056-7 (Link to this contribution) The Minister is referring to the regular Army, but the Territorial Army is also an important part of...
Tobias Ellwood | 459 c1059 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the Minister for giving way. He spoke briefly about procurement, and I am a bit con...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1058-9 (Link to this contribution) I can tell the hon. Gentleman that I recently had a meeting with the Minister of State, Department f...
Mike Hancock | 459 c1056 (Link to this contribution) It was on the training of the trainers.
Lord Beamish | 459 c1067 (Link to this contribution) It is easy for the hon. Gentleman to perpetuate such myths for media attention and headlines, but wh...
Lord Arbuthnot of Edrom | 459 c1067 (Link to this contribution) I asked General Richards the question on Tuesday. I think I asked, ““Is there anything you’d like to...
Liam Fox | 459 c1067 (Link to this contribution) That is one of the few occasions on which anyone in the military in Afghanistan has said such a thin...
Liam Fox | 459 c1068 (Link to this contribution) That there is such a clear difference between the Opposition and the Government in the interpretatio...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1068-9 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman raises an important point. We are in close touch with the South African Governmen...
Liam Fox | 459 c1068 (Link to this contribution) If my hon. Friend will permit me, I want to make some progress. The Minister talked about January’s...
Liam Fox | 459 c1069 (Link to this contribution) Notwithstanding the Minister’s answer, we need to know what the Government intend to do if it is dec...
Liam Fox | 459 c1069-70 (Link to this contribution) In the north-east, as the hon. Member for North Durham (Mr. Jones) is no doubt about tell me, there ...
Liam Fox | 459 c1063-5 (Link to this contribution) It would be a very good thing if relationships on the ground could be improved, but my point is that...
Lord Lancaster of Kimbolton | 459 c1063 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is right to make the link between support for families and retention. May I draw his ...
Lord Arbuthnot of Edrom | 459 c1063 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend has just made an extremely interesting point that almost exactly parallels the experi...
Liam Fox | 459 c1066 (Link to this contribution) It would be with some fear that I would disagree with my hon. Friend about anything, but I am sure t...
Lord Soames of Fletching | 459 c1066 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that one of the problems with planning operations is that the Ministers no...
Liam Fox | 459 c1065-6 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend makes an extraordinarily important point that gives me an opportunity to praise the f...
Liam Fox | 459 c1066-7 (Link to this contribution) As my hon. Friend knows, I have made that point in the House on a number of occasions, and I have re...
Tony Baldry | 459 c1066 (Link to this contribution) There is another point that the Government need to take into account. We have to make sure that our ...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 459 c1073-4 (Link to this contribution) As we heard from the speeches of the Minister and the hon. Member for Woodspring (Dr. Fox), defence ...
Lord Arbuthnot of Edrom | 459 c1074 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady touched briefly on the way in which the naval base review might affect personnel in Po...
Liam Fox | 459 c1075 (Link to this contribution) Does the hon. Lady accept that one of the risks of delay is that we lose the skills base that we req...
Linda Gilroy | 459 c1070 (Link to this contribution) I share the hon. Gentleman’s concern about exportability, not least because of the supply chain in t...
Liam Fox | 459 c1070 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady is exactly right. Small businesses are the bedrock of our economy and whenever we can ...
Harry Cohen | 459 c1070 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
Liam Fox | 459 c1071 (Link to this contribution) No, not for the moment. Another example is that of the Tornado. The cost of development and product...
Lord Beamish | 459 c1071 (Link to this contribution) I totally agree with support for the British defence industry, but can the hon. Gentleman explain wh...
Liam Fox | 459 c1071-3 (Link to this contribution) I not only refute but resent the implication of that question. Conservative Members have never playe...
Bob Russell | 459 c1081-3 (Link to this contribution) I welcome the hon. Gentleman’s intervention. It is an interesting idea, but I have to confess that i...
Bob Russell | 459 c1079-81 (Link to this contribution) I start by joining the Minister of State in expressing condolences to the families of those members ...
Lord Beamish | 459 c1075 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that those on the Liberal Democrat Benches who publicly argued against Tri...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 459 c1075-7 (Link to this contribution) I agree. The dangers inherent in that delay are very important. Some people made the point that the...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 459 c1075 (Link to this contribution) Again, I find myself agreeing. It is most important that we ensure that we maintain that skills base...
Brian Jenkins | 459 c1079 (Link to this contribution) I am listening intently to my hon. Friend’s valuable contribution, but my difficulty is this: how do...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 459 c1079 (Link to this contribution) The incentive to be innovative will come from the contract, which says that in return for a long-run...
Lord Beamish | 459 c1077 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that what has been achieved in a short time is a first-rate system, which ...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 459 c1077-8 (Link to this contribution) I thank my hon. Friend for his intervention. He is absolutely right. My point is that we should use ...
Linda Gilroy | 459 c1086-90 (Link to this contribution) To follow on from the point made by the hon. Member for Colchester (Bob Russell), it is always a ple...
Harry Cohen | 459 c1090 (Link to this contribution) I want to take my hon. Friend back to her comments about the Chinook helicopter being bought by the ...
Lord Beamish | 459 c1084 (Link to this contribution) Is the hon. Gentleman aware that that was a key recommendation of the excellent Select Committee rep...
Bob Russell | 459 c1084-5 (Link to this contribution) I am aware of that, and I am grateful that the Select Committee made the recommendation, which I end...
Robert Key | 459 c1085 (Link to this contribution) Like me, the hon. Gentleman has in his constituency an important interface between the Ministry of D...
Mike Hancock | 459 c1083 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that it is a bizarre contradiction of what we are trying to do with marrie...
Bob Russell | 459 c1083 (Link to this contribution) I am not surprised to hear that. The whole scenario and saga of that privatisation, the small print ...
Robert Goodwill | 459 c1084 (Link to this contribution) Is the hon. Gentleman aware of the problem in relation to statemented children? Army personnel have ...
Bob Russell | 459 c1084 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for that intervention. He is on the armed forces scheme with me ...
Speaker | 459 c1127 (Link to this contribution) Order. I remind the hon. Gentleman of what I said earlier. The debate is about defence in the UK.
Adam Holloway | 459 c1127-8 (Link to this contribution) I am just trying to point, Madam Deputy Speaker, to what I consider to be a form of sophistry, an en...
Julian Lewis | 459 c1128-30 (Link to this contribution) I sympathise with you, Madam Deputy Speaker, in your endeavours to restrict contributions to relevan...
Speaker | 459 c1130 (Link to this contribution) Order. I hope that the hon. Gentleman is now going to relate his remarks to the topic under debate.
Julian Lewis | 459 c1130-1 (Link to this contribution) I certainly am, Madam Deputy Speaker, but I think it essential that the defence of the United Kingdo...
Derek Twigg | 459 c1131-4 (Link to this contribution) This has been a wide-ranging and considered debate, with a surprising amount of consensus on some is...
Derek Twigg | 459 c1134-5 (Link to this contribution) I was just about to mention my hon. Friend. She made a strong case for Plymouth, as she has done for...
Ann Winterton | 459 c1113-6 (Link to this contribution) It was a pleasure to be in the House this afternoon to hear the sterling contribution of my hon. Fri...
Speaker | 459 c1119 (Link to this contribution) Order. Quite a few Members are still hoping to catch my eye, and the time left in this debate is lim...
Robert Syms | 459 c1124-6 (Link to this contribution) I do not usually contribute to defence debates, and I have learned an awful lot by listening to the ...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1126 (Link to this contribution) I reiterate what I said earlier. We are actively considering the matter to find the best solution. C...
Mike Hancock | 459 c1119-22 (Link to this contribution) Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. I wish that some of the Members who spoke earlier had borne that ad...
James Gray | 459 c1122-4 (Link to this contribution) I shall be brief because I know that two of my hon. Friends are keen to speak before the winding-up ...
Adam Holloway | 459 c1127 (Link to this contribution) The point that I am trying to make, Madam Deputy Speaker, is that the gap between ground truth, as t...
Robert Syms | 459 c1126 (Link to this contribution) I welcome the Minister’s helpful intervention. There is a problem—I am glad that the Government are ...
Adam Holloway | 459 c1126-7 (Link to this contribution) Our troops are performing magnificently in Iraq and Afghanistan but I fear that they are being let d...
Lord Soames of Fletching | 459 c1105-7 (Link to this contribution) I entirely agree with my hon. Friend. There has been a series of very unfortunate events which, beca...
Gerald Howarth | 459 c1105 (Link to this contribution) I agree entirely with my hon. Friend. He will recall that there is an old Army adage: ““Train hard a...
Bruce George | 459 c1107-8 (Link to this contribution) I apologise for missing the opening speeches and two hours of the debate. I was attending a dinner t...
Bruce George | 459 c1112 (Link to this contribution) Well, it is the one place that the hon. Gentleman has not visited. I cannot think of many places tha...
Bruce George | 459 c1112-3 (Link to this contribution) Well, perhaps the hon. Gentleman has been there once. To try to minimise criticism, I mentioned ear...
Lord Beamish | 459 c1111 (Link to this contribution) Everything is not as black and gloomy as my right hon. Friend is suggesting. His successor, the righ...
Bruce George | 459 c1111-2 (Link to this contribution) I am aware of that, although I am grateful to my hon. Friend for pointing it out. However, that is n...
Lord Arbuthnot of Edrom | 459 c1094-5 (Link to this contribution) It is obvious from the way in which the hon. Member for Plymouth, Sutton (Linda Gilroy) spoke that s...
Linda Gilroy | 459 c1093-4 (Link to this contribution) I was about to come on to that. The hon. Gentleman is not taking into account the fact that the cake...
Julian Lewis | 459 c1092-3 (Link to this contribution) May I remind the hon. Lady that the only reason why the figure of 2.5 per cent. is being bruited abr...
Linda Gilroy | 459 c1092 (Link to this contribution) It might be. However, although they say that, they have thus far refused to say how much money they ...
Lord Soames of Fletching | 459 c1102-5 (Link to this contribution) I agree with a great deal of what the hon. Member for North Durham (Mr. Jones) has said, particularl...
Lord Arbuthnot of Edrom | 459 c1097-8 (Link to this contribution) I agree and I will make a further point that relates precisely to what my hon. Friend says. It may h...
Lord Beamish | 459 c1098-102 (Link to this contribution) May I say how pleased I am to contribute to this timely and important debate? No one can get away fr...
Lord Arbuthnot of Edrom | 459 c1095-7 (Link to this contribution) Damn it, I really should know better than to give way to the hon. Lady, as she has said exactly what...
Liam Fox | 459 c1097 (Link to this contribution) I cannot quite remember who said, ““Advisers advise, Ministers decide,? but does my right hon. Frien...
Linda Gilroy | 459 c1095 (Link to this contribution) I am following the right hon. Gentleman’s speech carefully. Does he agree that in the information wa...
Linda Gilroy | 459 c1090 (Link to this contribution) It is a matter to be deplored. I can only say that it is a mark of the current Secretary of State th...
Gerald Howarth | 459 c1092 (Link to this contribution) This is the ““attack? section.
Linda Gilroy | 459 c1091-2 (Link to this contribution) I do not want to go into attack mode too soon, as I have a little attack section which I will come t...
Lord Beamish | 459 c1091 (Link to this contribution) As we have entered a new era in which the right hon. Member for North-East Hampshire (Mr. Arbuthnot)...
Linda Gilroy | 459 c1091 (Link to this contribution) I can only say that the right hon. Gentleman, who chairs our Committee so ably, is obviously capable...
Adam Ingram | 459 c1056 (Link to this contribution) Yes, the quality of instructors was identified as an issue, and, in response, we put in place a more...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 459 c1075 (Link to this contribution) I could not agree more. Given that 50 per cent. of the entire naval married quarters are in the Port...
Bob Russell | 459 c1085-6 (Link to this contribution) I thank the hon. Gentleman for that contribution. If anything, his scenario sounds worse than that i...
Speaker | 459 c1127 (Link to this contribution) Order. I have allowed a passing reference to Iraq and Afghanistan, but the debate is about defence i...
Bruce George | 459 c1108-11 (Link to this contribution) I am sorry to show how bipartisan the report was. Therefore, Governments fail. At the beginning of ...
Mike Hancock | 459 c1056 (Link to this contribution) Like the right hon. Gentleman, I hope that the lessons from Deepcut and in respect of the duty of ca...
Bernard Jenkin | 459 c1065 (Link to this contribution) Before my hon. Friend moves on from post-traumatic stress, does he share my concern that there is no...
Harry Cohen | 459 c1116-9 (Link to this contribution) Before I start my own speech, I would like to comment on what the shadow Secretary of State for Defe...
Lord Arbuthnot of Edrom | 459 c1091 (Link to this contribution) I understand that it is all my fault. I understand that on my first day as Minister for Defence Proc...
Lord Beamish | 459 c1081 (Link to this contribution) Does the hon. Gentleman agree that something that the Veterans Agency, the Ministry of Defence and t...
Subjects
Armed forces Cost effectiveness Defence Army Air force Health services Finance Families Education Iraq Peacekeeping operations Staff Policy Navy Military bases Military aircraft Ministry of Defence Standards Training Afghanistan Territorial Army
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