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Debate on bill on Monday, 21 April 2008, in the House of Lords.

Criminal Justice and Immigration Bill

Criminal Justice and Immigration Bill. Lords report stage third day. Amendment 81 negatived on division (124 votes to 67). Amendment 82 agreed to on division (183 votes to 113). Amendment 85 negatived on division (99 votes to 66). Part 2 of 3 records.

Secondary information

Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
700 c1281-327 
Session
2007-08
Department
Ministry of Justice
Legislative stage
Report stage
Procedure
New clauses
Chamber / Committee
House of Lords chamber
Related items
Proceeding contributions
Earl of Onslow | 700 c1310 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, that is exactly the point that we are making. Somebody should be regulated and tested to m...
Lord Thomas of Gresford | 700 c1313-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble and learned Baroness wished me to remain in my seat until she had finished her r...
Show all contributions (73)
Baroness Scotland of Asthal | 700 c1313 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I hope that I will be able to assist the noble Lord. The effect of the amendment, as he su...
Lord Kingsland | 700 c1313 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I had imagined that that matter would be dealt with by the noble Lord, Lord West of Spithe...
Baroness Scotland of Asthal | 700 c1311-3 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, they are trained; they are regulated by the CPS; they are properly managed. They have acce...
Baroness Scotland of Asthal | 700 c1315 (Link to this contribution) It is difficult, my Lords. I wrote to the chairman of the Magistrates’ Association on 12 March, and ...
Lord Kingsland | 700 c1315-6 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank the noble and learned Baroness for her full reply and thank all noble—and noble an...
Baroness Scotland of Asthal | 700 c1314 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I understand that a survey has been carried out but I do not know its final results; I hav...
Baroness Carnegy of Lour | 700 c1314-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have listened with enormous interest to this debate. It seems that much the most importa...
Lord Kingsland | 700 c1318 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendments Nos. 83 to 84A: 83: Clause 55, page 38, line 5, at end insert ““or offences which...
Earl of Onslow | 700 c1306 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, If I make good jokes, I am delighted but it brings the point home. That is what should hap...
Lord Elystan-Morgan | 700 c1307 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, this amendment does not have the effect of banning all non-legal staff from court prosecut...
Lord Mayhew of Twysden | 700 c1307 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, when the noble and learned Baroness the Attorney-General responds, which I feel sure she w...
Viscount Bledisloe | 700 c1307-8 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I entirely agree with the noble Lord, Lord Kingsland, that it is essential for people fulf...
Lord Neill of Bladen | 700 c1308-9 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I declare an interest as a barrister. The Bar is opposed to the proposal and the chairman ...
Lord Slynn of Hadley | 700 c1309 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, like my noble friend Lord Bledisloe, I do not see where the problem of requiring training ...
Baroness Howe of Idlicote | 700 c1309 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I shall be extremely brief. As a previous magistrate and someone who is surrounded by lawy...
Baroness Scotland of Asthal | 700 c1309-10 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank all noble Lords who have spoken. First, I need to say to the noble Lord, Lord King...
Lord Thomas of Gresford | 700 c1300 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for his reply. However, we think that there is a basic princ...
Lord Bach | 700 c1299-300 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, Amendment No. 81 is similar to the amendment moved by the noble Baroness, Lady Linklater, ...
Viscount Tenby | 700 c1298 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I support strongly what my noble friend Lord Elystan-Morgan has just said. In fact, we are...
Earl of Onslow | 700 c1306 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, an old expression states that if you pay peanuts, you get monkeys. In this case, I suspect...
Baroness Butler-Sloss | 700 c1305-6 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I, too, support the amendment. I am very grateful to the noble and learned Baroness the At...
Lord Kingsland | 700 c1302-4 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 82: 82: Clause 55, page 38, line 3, at end insert— ““( ) After subsection (1) ...
Lord Thomas of Gresford | 700 c1304-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, we on these Benches support this amendment. The noble Lord, Lord Kingsland, referred to th...
Lord Bach | 700 c1292-3 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, let me make it clear that the Government cannot support the amendment as it stands, but we...
Baroness Howe of Idlicote | 700 c1292 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I, too, support the amendment, as I did on a previous occasion. I am certain that the nobl...
Earl of Onslow | 700 c1297 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, it seems to me mad that we are not much more careful about sending young people aged under...
Baroness Howe of Idlicote | 700 c1297-8 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I supported this amendment on the previous occasion and of course I do so now. It is absur...
Baroness Butler-Sloss | 700 c1298 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am one of those to whom my noble friend referred as having previously spoken on this. I ...
Lord Elystan-Morgan | 700 c1298 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I, too, support the amendment. As have so many Members of your Lordships’ House on so many...
Earl of Onslow | 700 c1293 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, that is exactly the argument that I did not use. The argument that I used was that to put ...
Lord Bach | 700 c1293-4 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, of course I know what argument the noble Earl was putting, and we agree with that argument...
Baroness Falkner of Margravine | 700 c1295 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank noble Lords who have supported the broad thrust of the thinking behind this amendm...
Lord Thomas of Gresford | 700 c1295-7 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 81: 81: After Clause 53, insert the following new Clause— ““Accommodation in w...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 700 c1290 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 79B: 79B: Clause 48, page 35, line 36, at end insert— ““(2) The Secretary of S...
Baroness Falkner of Margravine | 700 c1289-90 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, there has been some confusion about the case despite comments from the Benches on our left...
Lord Kingsland | 700 c1292 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, we broadly support the propositions advanced by the noble Baroness, Lady Falkner. I note t...
Baroness Falkner of Margravine | 700 c1290-2 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 80: 80: After Clause 53, insert the following new Clause— ““Treatment of 17 ye...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 700 c1290 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendments Nos. 79G to 79K: 79G: Schedule 9, page 200, line 33, after ““16”” insert ““or und...
Earl of Onslow | 700 c1292 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, it seems to go without saying that the longer one keeps the young away from the experience...
Earl of Onslow | 700 c1286 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, it beggars description that when the noble and learned Lord, Lord Lloyd of Berwick—who, in...
Baroness Butler-Sloss | 700 c1286 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have discussed this with the noble and learned Lord, Lord Lloyd of Berwick, and the pres...
Lord Davidson of Glen Clova | 700 c1286-8 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, with that introduction, perhaps I should have had some more sardines for my breakfast this...
Lord Thomas of Gresford | 700 c1286 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, if by contemporary standards of justice there has been a miscarriage of justice in the pas...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 700 c1288 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 71: 71: Clause 42, page 33, line 32, leave out from ““after”” to ““In”” in lin...
Lord Lloyd of Berwick | 700 c1288 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, first, a possible answer for the noble Lord, Lord Campbell of Alloway, is that the amendme...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 700 c1288 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendments Nos. 74 to 76: 74: Clause 43, page 34, line 6, leave out from ““after”” to ““In””...
Lord Hunt of Chesterton | 700 c1288 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 72: 72: Clause 42, page 33, line 37, leave out from ““after”” to ““In”” in lin...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 700 c1289 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendments Nos. 78 and 79: 78: Schedule 8, page 192, line 38, leave out from beginning to ““...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 700 c1289 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 77A: 77A: Schedule 8, page 192, line 9, leave out from ““substitute”” to ““and...
Lord Lloyd of Berwick | 700 c1284-5 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 70A: 70A: Clause 42, page 33, leave out lines 27 to 30 and insert— ““(1C) In d...
Lord Davidson of Glen Clova | 700 c1284 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 70: 70: Clause 42, page 33, line 25, leave out from ““after”” to ““In”” in lin...
Lord Kingsland | 700 c1284 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the Minister asked me whether I would be pleased at the concession that the Government hav...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 700 c1282-4 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 69: 69: Clause 35, page 27, leave out lines 31 to 38 and insert— ““(c) subsect...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 700 c1282 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendments Nos. 66G and 66H: 66G: Clause 32, page 24, line 18, at end insert ““with the modi...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 700 c1282 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 66F: 66F: Clause 29, page 21, line 42, leave out ““255A(2)(b)”” and insert ““2...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 700 c1281-2 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendments Nos. 66D and 66E: 66D: Clause 29, page 20, line 44, leave out from beginning to e...
Lord Campbell of Alloway | 700 c1285-6 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I intervene briefly because I cannot look at this from the point of view of an academic la...
Lord Kingsland | 700 c1285 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble and learned Lord, Lord Lloyd of Berwick, should not be surprised by the Governme...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 700 c1281 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 66C: 66C: Clause 29, page 20, line 18, leave out ““(2)(b)”” and insert ““(2)(a...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 700 c1281 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendments Nos. 66A and 66B: 66A: Clause 29, page 19, line 40, at end insert— ““(aa) in a ca...
Lord Bach | 700 c1327 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I beg to move that further consideration on Report be now adjourned. In moving the Motion,...
Baroness Butler-Sloss | 700 c1321-2 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I, too, support this amendment and also speak to Amendment No. 85A, which is linked. Actua...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 700 c1322-5 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, we return to the question of youth justice. I suppose there have been two overriding theme...
Lord Elystan-Morgan | 700 c1320-1 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I, too, support this amendment completely. I am sure that it will be the Minister’s case, ...
Baroness Howe of Idlicote | 700 c1321 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have seldom been happier to see my noble friend Lord Judd—and he certainly is a friend, ...
Lord Ramsbotham | 700 c1318-20 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 85: 85: After Clause 58, insert the following new Clause— ““Looked-after child...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 700 c1289 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 79A: 79A: Clause 48, page 35, line 34, leave out ““offenders aged 16 and 17”” ...
Baroness Falkner of Margravine | 700 c1320 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, my name is attached to the amendment. The noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, clearly set out why...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 700 c1290 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendments Nos. 79C to 79E: 79C: Schedule 9, page 199, line 26, at beginning insert ““ ““You...
Lord Hunt of Kings Heath | 700 c1290 (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 79L: 79L: Schedule 10, page 204, line 13, leave out ““persons aged 16 or 17”” ...
Lord Ramsbotham | 700 c1325-6 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank the Minister for replying in his customary full and courteous way. I listened in p...
Subjects
Criminal proceedings Children in care Bail Administration of justice Crown Prosecution Service Court of Appeal Legal profession Legal opinion Northern Ireland Magistrates' courts Prisoners on remand Training Young offenders Reoffenders Secure accommodation Secure training centres Young offender institutions
Legislation
Criminal Justice and Immigration Bill 2006-07 to 2007-08
Link
View this Parliamentary proceeding on www.publications.parliament.uk