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Debate on bill on Wednesday, 17 June 2009, in the House of Commons.

Business Rate Supplements Bill

Business Rate Supplements Bill. Programme motion (No. 4) on Lords amendments and subsequent stages agreed to on question. Lords amendments considered. Lords amendments 1 to 6 and 11 to 14 disagreed to, with Commons amendment in lieu. Lords amendments 7 to 10 and 15 agreed to. Committee appointed to draw up reasons to be assigned to the Lords for disagreeing to their amendments 11 and 12. Reasons reported and agreed to. Message to the Lords to communicate reasons, Bill and amendments.

Secondary information

Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
494 c339-81 
Session
2008-09
Department
Department for Communities and Local Government
Legislative stage
Lords amendments
Procedure
Programme motions
Chamber / Committee
House of Commons chamber
Related items
Proceeding contributions
Speaker | 494 c340 (Link to this contribution) Before I comment on matters of privilege, I would like to say a few words. Deputy Speakers may not t...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c340 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That this House disagrees with Lords amendment 1.
Show all contributions (87)
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c342-3 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman can take comfort from the evidence given by organisations such as the Local Gover...
Speaker | 494 c340 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss the following: Lords amendment 2 and Government motion to...
Dan Rogerson | 494 c342 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the Minister for being so generous in giving way. What reassurance can she give bus...
Nick Raynsford | 494 c342 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Member for Bromley and Chislehurst (Robert Neill) may have slightly misrepresented the posi...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c342 (Link to this contribution) As ever, my right hon. Friend's considerable knowledge of local government shines through. As Lord ...
Robert Neill | 494 c341 (Link to this contribution) I am interested in what the Minister is saying, but I am trying to reconcile the logic of her argume...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c342 (Link to this contribution) I am merely giving a possible example. In the broad sense, obviously we expect the BRS to be much wi...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c340-1 (Link to this contribution) The Bill was amended in the other place on Report, so a ballot is required before any business rate ...
Lord Field of Birkenhead | 494 c375 (Link to this contribution) The Minister has confused the position. We are not asking for an unfair redistribution of the rateab...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c375-6 (Link to this contribution) We are talking about two different issues here. One is the principle that separate assessment would ...
Robert Neill | 494 c375 (Link to this contribution) I appreciate that the Minister is new in her post, but does she accept that, although separate asses...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c375 (Link to this contribution) As far as I am aware, and according to the figures that I have, the 1,600 properties were liable for...
Ian Cawsey | 494 c373-5 (Link to this contribution) I shall not detain the House too long, because when we debate this issue I feel increasingly that I ...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c375 (Link to this contribution) With the leave of the House, I shall respond briefly to some of the points raised in the debate, but...
Austin Mitchell | 494 c372 (Link to this contribution) I am sorry, Mr. Deputy Speaker. It was tactless of me to refer to the complexions of those people in...
Dan Rogerson | 494 c372-3 (Link to this contribution) Our debate has become a little lively for this time of the afternoon. Interestingly, in many of our ...
Dan Rogerson | 494 c376 (Link to this contribution) I echo the comments that other hon. Members have made: the problem is not of the Minister's creation...
Robert Neill | 494 c376 (Link to this contribution) The Minister is being clear, but will she concede that, according to the figures she has given, only...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c376 (Link to this contribution) I doubt that I can give a great deal of comfort, because the solutions suggested by hon. Members are...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c377 (Link to this contribution) I am more than happy to look into the fast-track system. However, the total number of proposals rela...
Austin Mitchell | 494 c377 (Link to this contribution) I fear that what the Minister said was not correct. The principle of the argument that we are urging...
Speaker | 494 c377 (Link to this contribution) Order. That is a long intervention. The hon. Gentleman has made his point.
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c377 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend has the measure of me on that. I do not have the details of those regulations. I go ...
Robert Neill | 494 c343 (Link to this contribution) The Minister is being very generous. I hope that I shall not need to intervene again. In the contex...
Robert Neill | 494 c348 (Link to this contribution) Will the right hon. Gentleman add, for the sake of completeness, that the same Mayor of London says ...
Nick Raynsford | 494 c348 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman will know very well that the Crossrail BRS levy will be in place for some 20 year...
Nick Raynsford | 494 c347-8 (Link to this contribution) I must say to the hon. Gentleman that there is a total inconsistency in arguing that Crossrail is a ...
Nick Raynsford | 494 c346-7 (Link to this contribution) It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Bromley and Chislehurst (Robert Neill). He referred i...
Robert Neill | 494 c347 (Link to this contribution) I thank the right hon. Gentleman for giving way with his customary courtesy. How does he reconcile t...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c343-4 (Link to this contribution) I will ascertain from my right hon. Friend's office when a response will be forthcoming, but I am su...
Robert Neill | 494 c344-6 (Link to this contribution) This is the first time that I have had the pleasure of doing business on local government issues wit...
Dan Rogerson | 494 c349-50 (Link to this contribution) I am experiencing déjà vu, albeit that some of the faces have changed; I, of course, welcome the new...
Nick Raynsford | 494 c350 (Link to this contribution) In most BID cases—I cannot say all, because I am not sure of the precise figures—the BID levy is far...
Dan Rogerson | 494 c350 (Link to this contribution) Clearly, that is the Government's argument—that it is possible to have a threshold beyond which the ...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c350-1 (Link to this contribution) I thank the hon. Members who have contributed to this debate. I am sure that the hon. Members for Br...
Dan Rogerson | 494 c351 (Link to this contribution) We want to see far greater tax-raising powers devolved to the local level, but this issue involves a...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c351 (Link to this contribution) Nevertheless, the fact remains that he takes a totally different view from a fellow Liberal Democrat...
Speaker | 494 c355 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss Lords amendments 10 and 15.
Speaker | 494 c357 (Link to this contribution) I now have to announce the result of a Division deferred from a previous day. On the motion relating...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c355-7 (Link to this contribution) The amendments in this group were Government amendments, tabled in the other place. They relate to p...
Robert Neill | 494 c357 (Link to this contribution) I am glad to say that on this occasion, there is a degree of consensus. As those who served on the B...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c359 (Link to this contribution) I just want to respond quickly to the hon. Member for Bromley and Chislehurst (Robert Neill), who as...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c359 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That this House agrees with Lords amendment 8.
Nick Raynsford | 494 c357-8 (Link to this contribution) I congratulate the Government on agreeing in another place this series of amendments, which provide ...
Dan Rogerson | 494 c359 (Link to this contribution) It is a pleasure to follow the right hon. Member for Greenwich and Woolwich (Mr. Raynsford). He has ...
Speaker | 494 c359 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss Lords amendment 9.
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c361 (Link to this contribution) As right hon. and hon. Members are aware, Lords amendments 11 and 12 are intended to prevent the BRS...
Speaker | 494 c361 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss Lords amendment 12, and Government motion to disagree.
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c362 (Link to this contribution) I appreciate the point that my hon. Friend is making. However, the special provision in regulation 1...
Austin Mitchell | 494 c362 (Link to this contribution) This is the same standard argument that has been given to us during our lengthy discussions on the B...
Dan Rogerson | 494 c360 (Link to this contribution) I echo the comments just made by the hon. Member for Bromley and Chislehurst (Robert Neill). During ...
Robert Neill | 494 c360 (Link to this contribution) This is one issue on which there was unanimity during our previous considerations; everybody wanted ...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c361 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That this House disagrees with Lords amendment 11.
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c359-60 (Link to this contribution) These amendments were brought forward and accepted by the other place to exempt, in all circumstance...
Austin Mitchell | 494 c363 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful. My hon. Friend says that it would be unfair if retrospective rates were not levied. T...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c363 (Link to this contribution) Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker. On Lords amendments 11 and 12, I commend the quality of the debate i...
Speaker | 494 c363 (Link to this contribution) Order. May I say to the hon. Gentleman that we are getting rather sidetracked away from the amendmen...
Ian Cawsey | 494 c363 (Link to this contribution) Will my hon. Friend give way on that point?
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c362 (Link to this contribution) I thank my hon. Friend for her intervention. We are moving off business rate supplements slightly, b...
Shona McIsaac | 494 c362 (Link to this contribution) I apologise for intervening, but I have to be in Westminster Hall for an Adjournment debate shortly....
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c362 (Link to this contribution) I have to beg to disagree with my hon. Friend, because the individual properties were not on the lis...
Austin Mitchell | 494 c362 (Link to this contribution) That surely cannot be true, because the principle of individual assessment began in 2005 when, the V...
Julian Brazier | 494 c365 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is making his speech in his usual highly articulate way, but he is being too kind to ...
Robert Neill | 494 c365 (Link to this contribution) I know that the right hon. Gentleman is in a difficult situation, as candidates for anything sometim...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c363 (Link to this contribution) I do not want to dwell on the specific issue of ports, and I am sure that there will be opportunitie...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c364 (Link to this contribution) I can only reiterate that the amendments that we are debating will have no effect on the current pos...
Austin Mitchell | 494 c364 (Link to this contribution) There is a vital principle for those of us who represent ports: businesses should not wantonly be pu...
Ian Cawsey | 494 c365 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his support on the matter. If we were to try to summarise th...
Robert Neill | 494 c364 (Link to this contribution) I have some sympathy for the Under-Secretary—up to a point. The only reason for having any sympathy ...
Lord Field of Birkenhead | 494 c365 (Link to this contribution) I apologise for missing the opening speeches. As I understand it, the hon. Gentleman is going to sup...
Robert Neill | 494 c365 (Link to this contribution) I am afraid that the hon. Gentleman puts the case very well. I wish that we had a specific legislati...
Speaker | 494 c372 (Link to this contribution) Order. The hon. Gentleman is a very experienced Member of the House, so he will know that we do not ...
Austin Mitchell | 494 c369-72 (Link to this contribution) I was under the impression that I had just said that, but it is indeed true. The operators have been...
Lord Field of Birkenhead | 494 c369 (Link to this contribution) May I issue a plea to my hon. Friend to stop pulling his punches? Is not the position even worse? Op...
Julian Brazier | 494 c366 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to my hon. Friend for giving way, particularly now that he is getting into his stride ...
Lord Field of Birkenhead | 494 c366 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman is being unfair to Pontius Pilate. Pilate wanted to release Jesus, but we have se...
Robert Neill | 494 c365-6 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is absolutely right. That is why it is so important to entrench the proposal, to prev...
Austin Mitchell | 494 c368-9 (Link to this contribution) I support Lords amendments 11 and 12. It is unusual to find myself in such agreement with the hon. M...
Robert Neill | 494 c367-8 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend takes a particular interest in transport matters, and he is absolutely right. The Bi...
Julian Brazier | 494 c367 (Link to this contribution) May I stress again that people do not have to come to British ports? There is nothing to prevent the...
Robert Neill | 494 c366-7 (Link to this contribution) It is a most perverse situation. Ministers in the Department for Communities and Local Government do...
Sarah McCarthy-Fry | 494 c355 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That this House agrees with Lords amendment 7.
Robert Neill | 494 c366 (Link to this contribution) The right hon. Gentleman is characteristically perceptive and well informed, and he is right. I am s...
Subjects
Local government Business rates Surcharges
Legislation
Business Rate Supplements Bill 2008-09
Link
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