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Debate on bill and Committee proceeding on Tuesday, 24 June 2008, in the House of Lords.

Energy Bill

Secondary information

Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
702 c561-614GC 
Session
2007-08
Department
Department for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform
Legislative stage
Committee stage
Procedure
New clauses
Chamber / Committee
House of Lords Grand Committee
Related items
Proceeding contributions
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c585-6GC (Link to this contribution) It would not. But, as I indicated, over time, a power station that is constructed in five years’ tim...
Lord Bach | 702 c574-5GC (Link to this contribution) These amendments have been grouped together because, if accepted, each of them would place additiona...
Show all contributions (105)
Lord Bach | 702 c571-2GC (Link to this contribution) I hardly dare venture into this debate. I will try to be as brave as I can. I am grateful to the nob...
Baroness Wilcox | 702 c573GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 42: 42: Clause 43, page 40, line 9, at end insert— ““( ) the Nuclear Decommiss...
Lord Redesdale | 702 c571GC (Link to this contribution) On that point, did the noble Lord mean ““tree huggers”” as a description of all those people who are...
Baroness Carnegy of Lour | 702 c569-70GC (Link to this contribution) As we come to Chapter 1 in Part 3, I hope that it is in order if I ask the Minister a question which...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c566-8GC (Link to this contribution) No, I am grateful to the noble Lord. Whether Dr Stone will be employed continually may be a matter f...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c564-6GC (Link to this contribution) There is no guilty party, so let us all proceed in our innocence, although we are dealing with an ex...
Lord Palmer | 702 c564GC (Link to this contribution) I, too, support the amendment, as all parties seem to do. The noble Lord, Lord Jenkin, made an impor...
Lord Redesdale | 702 c609GC (Link to this contribution) Far be it for me to say that the department is not principled in its objection, and it is certainly ...
Lord De Mauley | 702 c614GC (Link to this contribution) I thank the Minister for his response. I will give it consideration.
Lord Bach | 702 c590-1GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 46: 46: Clause 53, page 46, line 43, at end insert— ““( ) In this section ““se...
Lord Teverson | 702 c594GC (Link to this contribution) I do not understand the case put by the Minister. If you want to de-risk the decommissioning fund, w...
Lord Bach | 702 c598-9GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 50: 50: Clause 67, page 56, line 5, at end insert— ““( ) In section 114(2) of ...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c608-9GC (Link to this contribution) As ever, I have enjoyed the debate, although I am not sure that I will engage in ““The Archers”” dim...
Lord Haskel | 702 c561GC (Link to this contribution) I apologise for the fact that my speech may be a little slurred; that is not because I have had an e...
Lord Redesdale | 702 c562GC (Link to this contribution) Despite the opposition of those on these Benches to new nuclear build, I am not opposed to the amend...
Lord Teverson | 702 c586GC (Link to this contribution) What the Minister has described is a one-way bet against the taxpayer. I am trying to describe thing...
Lord Jenkin of Roding | 702 c579-80GC (Link to this contribution) I am sorry to hear that. We hope to see him before Committee stage is over. The advantage is that we...
Lord Jenkin of Roding | 702 c582GC (Link to this contribution) I have a feeling that the Minister will be like the third judge in the Court of Appeal who says, ““I...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c582-5GC (Link to this contribution) We are in deep financial and business waters in which I was floundering until the noble Lord, Lord J...
Lord Jenkin of Roding | 702 c571GC (Link to this contribution) The noble Lord used the word ““posturing”” to describe the attitude of the present Government—as the...
Lord O'Neill of Clackmannan | 702 c570-1GC (Link to this contribution) I could not resist the opportunity to rise after the noble Baroness’s remarks. In the first instance...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c568GC (Link to this contribution) The noble Baroness is right, but the Government would have to be living in a blind hermit’s cave not...
Lord Jenkin of Roding | 702 c566GC (Link to this contribution) Before the Minister moves on, I want to ask him about his reference to Dr Stone's interim report, pu...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c564GC (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to all noble Lords who have spoken to the amendment and to the noble Baroness for havi...
Lord Redesdale | 702 c610-1GC (Link to this contribution) It would be strange to break the link. By its very nature, biomethane has to be cleaned and scrubbed...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c611GC (Link to this contribution) Earlier, I sought to show one way in which the link might be broken. We would be concerned about our...
Lord Redesdale | 702 c612GC (Link to this contribution) I thank the Minister for the proposed letter. The noble Lord, Lord Jenkin, is right because we tend ...
Lord Jenkin of Roding | 702 c588GC (Link to this contribution) One of my colleagues sent me a note, which is perhaps unkind to the Minister, stating: ““What he sai...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c589-90GC (Link to this contribution) I beg to move that the Committee adjourn for 10 minutes. Moved accordingly, and, on Question, Motio...
Lord Bach | 702 c591GC (Link to this contribution) Yes, we have consulted the insurance industry on this matter.
Lord Teverson | 702 c592-3GC (Link to this contribution) I was particularly interested in the list in paragraphs (a) to (e) of the amendment. I was wondering...
Lord De Mauley | 702 c591-2GC (Link to this contribution) These amendments concern the definition of security. They are important and helpful as far as they g...
Lord Bach | 702 c594GC (Link to this contribution) The best I can do is to say that funds will be expected to be established in a manner that maximises...
Lord Rowlands | 702 c603GC (Link to this contribution) I find that reply totally satisfactory. I would love, one of these days, to get ““shall”” instead of...
Lord Teverson | 702 c600GC (Link to this contribution) I must admit that I did not understand this clause one little bit. When a parliamentary clause gets ...
Lord Rowlands | 702 c599-600GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 51: 51: Clause 69, page 58, line 38, leave out ““may”” and insert ““shall”” T...
Lord Redesdale | 702 c603-5GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 53: 53: Before Clause 80, insert the following new Clause— ““Use of biomethane...
Lord Redesdale | 702 c607GC (Link to this contribution) Perhaps I should answer the question put to me by the noble Lord, Lord Jenkin. The amendment talks a...
Baroness Carnegy of Lour | 702 c607GC (Link to this contribution) This has been an interesting discussion. The noble Lord, Lord Redesdale, spoke at length about biome...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c586-8GC (Link to this contribution) I said that our debates would be enormously helpful and, indeed, they have been. Perhaps I may make ...
Lord Palmer | 702 c585GC (Link to this contribution) Perhaps I may add a supplementary to the question of the noble Lord, Lord Teverson. I hate interrupt...
Lord Woolmer of Leeds | 702 c586GC (Link to this contribution) The Minister said that if it turned out that there was a surplus in the fund and that the fixed-pric...
Lord Redesdale | 702 c575GC (Link to this contribution) Do those forums have a statutory basis? If the nature of the relationship, set out in the Bill, betw...
Baroness Wilcox | 702 c568-9GC (Link to this contribution) I thank the noble Lord, Lord Davies, for his very full answer. I am getting used to his very full an...
Baroness Carnegy of Lour | 702 c568GC (Link to this contribution) I do not know what my noble friend is going to say, but that sounded like a fairly good response. Ho...
Lord Jenkin of Roding | 702 c564GC (Link to this contribution) Something has gone wrong with the electronics. I rely on the aural loop and at the moment it is maki...
Lord Jenkin of Roding | 702 c562-4GC (Link to this contribution) I, too, support the amendment. The noble Lord, Lord Redesdale, referred to the French reactors being...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c609GC (Link to this contribution) No, I am saying that there is a direct link between the actual generation and the award of ROCs and ...
Lord Bach | 702 c614GC (Link to this contribution) This may be a convenient moment for the Committee to adjourn until tomorrow at 3.45 pm.
Lord Bach | 702 c613-4GC (Link to this contribution) The proposed new clause pertaining to an amendment to the EU emissions trading scheme and company re...
Lord De Mauley | 702 c612-3GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 54: 54: Before Clause 80, insert the following new Clause— ““Company annual re...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c611-2GC (Link to this contribution) I will not make any progress if I seek to reply to the noble Lord’s points any further, but I recogn...
Lord Jenkin of Roding | 702 c611GC (Link to this contribution) I am grateful for the Minister’s offer to write a letter. He said that there would be nothing to add...
Lord Palmer | 702 c589GC (Link to this contribution) Before the noble Lord, Lord Jenkin, withdraws the amendment, I must point out that I feel terribly s...
Lord Jenkin of Roding | 702 c589GC (Link to this contribution) As I said earlier, we will want to study carefully what the Minister said in his various replies. I ...
Baroness Carnegy of Lour | 702 c593-4GC (Link to this contribution) I may be being stupid but I did not hear the Minister answer the question put by the noble Lord, Lor...
Lord Bach | 702 c595-7GC (Link to this contribution) I thank both noble Lords. Clause 54 makes it a criminal offence for an operator or a person with obl...
Lord De Mauley | 702 c598GC (Link to this contribution) I am most grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Teverson, and my noble friend Lady Carnegy for their inte...
Lord Teverson | 702 c598GC (Link to this contribution) I did not catch the Minister’s reply on the maximum fine under subsection (3).
Lord Bach | 702 c598GC (Link to this contribution) I am sorry; the noble Lord is too polite—he did not catch it because I did not say it. I am advised ...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c603GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 52: 52: Clause 71, page 60, line 39, at end insert— ““(3A) In this section ““s...
Lord Jenkin of Roding | 702 c606GC (Link to this contribution) I have listened with great interest to the agricultural nature of this debate, but I think that it i...
Duke of Montrose | 702 c605-6GC (Link to this contribution) I declare an interest as a farmer who might consider getting involved in the production of biomethan...
Lord Oxburgh | 702 c607GC (Link to this contribution) I cannot speak to the detail of the amendment, but fundamentally it is very sensible and we ought to...
Lord Redesdale | 702 c608GC (Link to this contribution) Perhaps I should mention that once the biomethane has been extracted, the rest of the manure can be ...
Baroness Wilcox | 702 c561-2GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 41: 41: Before Clause 42, insert the following new Clause— ““Nuclear Installat...
Lord O'Neill of Clackmannan | 702 c580-2GC (Link to this contribution) I thank the noble Lord for the amendment because it gives the Government the opportunity to clarify ...
Lord Oxburgh | 702 c586GC (Link to this contribution) Before the Minister’s flow is interrupted, can I ask for another clarification? We are talking about...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c579GC (Link to this contribution) No, I was merely agreeing with the noble Lord that I hope my noble friend will be restored to health...
Lord Bach | 702 c575-7GC (Link to this contribution) As I understand it, they do not have a statutory basis. These are the engagement activities that the...
Baroness Wilcox | 702 c577-8GC (Link to this contribution) I thank the noble Lord, Lord Bach, for his response, and I thank the noble Lord, Lord Redesdale, for...
Lord Jenkin of Roding | 702 c578GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 43A: 43A: Clause 45, page 40, line 42, at end insert— ““and any such modificat...
Lord Bach | 702 c577GC (Link to this contribution) I shall try—the nuclear liabilities funding arrangements board, known as NLFAB. Information will als...
Baroness Carnegy of Lour | 702 c572-3GC (Link to this contribution) I thank those who joined in on this short discussion. It is extremely reassuring to know that the pr...
Lord Redesdale | 702 c573GC (Link to this contribution) We support the amendment on the basis that local communities will be involved through the local auth...
Lord Palmer | 702 c571GC (Link to this contribution) The words of the noble Baroness, Lady Carnegy, are extremely important. I was frightened to hear the...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c609-10GC (Link to this contribution) I am aware of that. There is nothing new under the sun and certainly not from this Dispatch Box. I k...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c610GC (Link to this contribution) Let me seek to elaborate the principle—or, as my noble friend Lord Whitty might say, the prejudice—o...
Lord Oxburgh | 702 c610GC (Link to this contribution) Could the link be maintained if the injector of methane made a deal with someone who burned gas to g...
Lord De Mauley | 702 c614GC (Link to this contribution) I beg leave to withdraw the amendment. Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.
Baroness Pitkeathley | 702 c614GC (Link to this contribution) The Committee stands adjourned until tomorrow.
Lord Teverson | 702 c613GC (Link to this contribution) I welcome the amendment about transparency in the EU ETS. I was very disappointed that since the Cli...
Lord Bach | 702 c614GC (Link to this contribution) I believe that the market price for the allocations is already published. What is commercially sensi...
Duke of Montrose | 702 c614GC (Link to this contribution) If under phase 2 of the EU ETS the units are subject to auction, surely the price will be different ...
Baroness Carnegy of Lour | 702 c591GC (Link to this contribution) Have the Government consulted the insurance industry about this? I do not know much about insurance,...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c588-9GC (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the noble Lord, who has shown the greatest understanding and maximised my chances—a...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c589GC (Link to this contribution) I understand the point that the noble Lord is making, but there are only two major problems to be re...
Lord Brougham and Vaux | 702 c590GC (Link to this contribution) The Committee will adjourn for 10 minutes until 14 minutes to the hour. [The Committee was adjourne...
Lord Bach | 702 c593GC (Link to this contribution) I shall do my best to answer the two noble Lords who have asked questions, but I am sure they know t...
Lord Bach | 702 c594GC (Link to this contribution) As I understand it, that is not how this system works. The fund is set up under this scheme in order...
Lord De Mauley | 702 c594-5GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 48: 48: Clause 54, page 47, line 27, leave out ““2”” and insert ““5”” The nob...
Lord Teverson | 702 c595GC (Link to this contribution) I agree with the noble Lord, Lord De Mauley, about the increase from two to five years. However, it ...
Lord Bach | 702 c598GC (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the noble Baroness but the provision is, "““to fail to comply with an obligation im...
Baroness Carnegy of Lour | 702 c598GC (Link to this contribution) Should the Bill not say that in Clause 54(1)? That is not clear from the wording of the Bill. I know...
Baroness Carnegy of Lour | 702 c597GC (Link to this contribution) In Clause 54, it is an offence, "““to fail to comply with an obligation … imposed by an approved … d...
Lord Bach | 702 c597-8GC (Link to this contribution) Those obligations are imposed in any case, but I venture to think that if the alleged offence were a...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 702 c601-2GC (Link to this contribution) I do not have a PowerPoint presentation to give because they are not allowed in our Committee. I was...
Lord Whitty | 702 c607GC (Link to this contribution) I was not going to intervene in this debate but the noble Lord, Lord Jenkin, reminded me that I was ...
Subjects
Disclosure of information Devolved matters Decommissioning Assets Costs Climate change Devolution Carbon dioxide Environment protection Energy Electricity generation Fines Insolvency Insurance Hazardous substances EU emissions trading scheme France Local government Planning Radioactive waste Nuclear power Nuclear Decommissioning Authority Power stations Scotland Security Safety Waste management Renewable energy Waste disposal Nuclear Installations Inspectorate Methane Committee on Radioactive Waste Management Greenhouse gas emissions
Legislation
Energy Bill 2007-08
Link
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