Parliamentary Search

Debate on bill on Friday, 17 March 2006, in the House of Commons, led by Eric Forth. The answering member was Malcolm Wicks.

Climate Change and Sustainable Energy Bill 2005-06

Climate Change and Sustainable Energy Bill. Report stage. Third reading debate adjourned. Debate to be resumed 12 May.

Secondary information

Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
443 c1705-79 
Session
2005-06
Department
Department of Trade and Industry
Legislative stage
Third reading
Report stage
Procedure
Private members' bills proceedings
Chamber / Committee
House of Commons chamber
Related items
Proceeding contributions
Speaker | 443 c1709 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss the following Government amendments: Nos. 40 and 41, No. ...
Richard Ottaway | 443 c1707 (Link to this contribution) My right hon. Friend is making a controversial point. Is not one of the difficulties caused by the f...
Show all contributions (282)
Eric Forth | 443 c1706-7 (Link to this contribution) —to acknowledge the potential role of the regions. [Laughter.] On 10 March, the Minister said"““Reg...
Speaker | 443 c1705-6 (Link to this contribution) I remind the House that with this we are discussing the following amendments: No. 8, in page 2, line...
Speaker | 443 c1708 (Link to this contribution) Order. I remind the right hon. Gentleman of the amendment on which he is winding up the debate. It i...
Eric Forth | 443 c1707-8 (Link to this contribution) I was just trailing what is to come, Madam Deputy Speaker. I wished to forewarn the House about the ...
Speaker | 443 c1707 (Link to this contribution) Order. I took the right hon. Gentleman at his word when he said that he would not test my patience e...
Eric Forth | 443 c1707 (Link to this contribution) I could not agree more, and I have made that point many times over the years. I regard it as my duty...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1709 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move amendment No. 39, in page 5, line 14, leave out from ‘““plant””’ to end of line 16 and...
Eric Forth | 443 c1708-9 (Link to this contribution) Indeed, and I am eager to get on to the very important debates that are coming up. I just wanted to ...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1714 (Link to this contribution) Does my right hon. Friend accept that it was slightly disingenuous of the Minister to say that these...
Eric Forth | 443 c1712-4 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to my hon. Friend. I cannot understand the reason for the delay, especially as we have...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1712 (Link to this contribution) Does my right hon. Friend realise that what the Minister said is no great deal, because under the te...
Eric Forth | 443 c1712 (Link to this contribution) Is not this debate useful? Are we not starting to elicit some really useful information? Thank goodn...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1712 (Link to this contribution) The strategy will be published by the end of this month.
Eric Forth | 443 c1711 (Link to this contribution) That may well be the case; I do not dispute that. However, it illustrates the potential difficulty. ...
Mark Lazarowicz | 443 c1711 (Link to this contribution) I refer to the declaration of interest that I made last week. I remind the right hon. Gentleman tha...
Eric Forth | 443 c1710 (Link to this contribution) I am glad my hon. Friend picked that point up, because I was going to mention it later on. It is sig...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1710 (Link to this contribution) Does my right hon. Friend realise that one of the amendments in this group— No. 80—has been produced...
Eric Forth | 443 c1710-1 (Link to this contribution) I am glad the hon. Gentleman is enjoying the debate. I hope he will stay for the whole five hours. ...
Lord Barker of Battle | 443 c1709 (Link to this contribution) As the Minister said, these are drafting amendments. The Bill has our full support and we wish to ma...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1709 (Link to this contribution) Good morning, Madam Deputy Speaker. I suspect that this will be one of the shorter speeches of the d...
Eric Forth | 443 c1709-10 (Link to this contribution) This is a very important group of amendments that deserves thorough scrutiny, although sadly there d...
Mike Weir | 443 c1711 (Link to this contribution) Does the right hon. Gentleman not accept that the Scottish Parliament has already taken a different ...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1720-1 (Link to this contribution) I am interested in what the hon. Gentleman says based on his visit to Woking. All I can say to him i...
Kelvin Hopkins | 443 c1720 (Link to this contribution) I understand from my recent visit to Woking that provided that waste is combusted at a sufficiently ...
Speaker | 443 c1721 (Link to this contribution) Order. I hope not because it is not relevant to the amendment that we are discussing.
Christopher Chope | 443 c1720 (Link to this contribution) But what is sustainable? Who is defining sustainable? The hon. Gentleman has declared an interest an...
Mark Lazarowicz | 443 c1719-20 (Link to this contribution) : That is precisely why the Bill’s title is the Climate Change and Sustainable Energy Bill, not the ...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1720 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman will accept that one of the things that binds all the bodies in the Sustainable E...
Mark Lazarowicz | 443 c1720 (Link to this contribution) May I make it clear to the hon. Gentleman that although I had assistance in the preparation of the B...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1719 (Link to this contribution) Absolutely, Madam Deputy Speaker. The point is made on fuel cells. We know that the list in Governm...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1719 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is absolutely right. Proposed new subsection (2)(i) in amendment No. 52 cites"““combi...
Speaker | 443 c1719 (Link to this contribution) Order. May I remind the hon. Gentleman of what I have already said? I think that we have heard suffi...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1719 (Link to this contribution) I do not know whether the Minister’s comment is directed to the letters editor of The Sunday Telegra...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1719 (Link to this contribution) We are all enjoying this satire on some of the wacky ideas around the area, but the hon. Gentleman’s...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1719 (Link to this contribution) Obviously, if a household wants to be economical in its use of electricity, one of the best things t...
Lord Whitehead | 443 c1719 (Link to this contribution) All right, let us try again. Does the hon. Gentleman suggest that we invest large amounts to stop pe...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1718-9 (Link to this contribution) I know that the hon. Gentleman has many powers, but I do not suggest that he should stop cloud forma...
Lord Whitehead | 443 c1718 (Link to this contribution) Is the hon. Gentleman saying that we should spend large amounts on stopping cloud formation?
Christopher Chope | 443 c1718 (Link to this contribution) The correspondent makes the point that there are large vested interests in climate change that are e...
Speaker | 443 c1718 (Link to this contribution) Order. I think that we have heard quite sufficient from the letter in The Sunday Telegraph.
Christopher Chope | 443 c1718 (Link to this contribution) This is an area of debate and, I submit, dispute. I certainly would not be so bold as to describe an...
Oliver Letwin | 443 c1717 (Link to this contribution) Again, I will not detain House for more than 30 seconds. Nobody was debating that fuel cells produce...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1717 (Link to this contribution) Following what my right hon. Friend the Member for Bromley and Chislehurst (Mr. Forth) said in respo...
Speaker | 443 c1718 (Link to this contribution) Order. I think the hon. Gentleman could relate those remarks in quoting that letter to the amendment...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1717 (Link to this contribution) I am surprised that my right hon. Friend should say that. If that is his view, I hope that he has wr...
Oliver Letwin | 443 c1718 (Link to this contribution) Again, I will not detain the House for long. The fact that there is a nut who writes to the papers d...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1718 (Link to this contribution) I am relating the letter to the amendments, Madam Deputy Speaker. My right hon. Friend the Member fo...
Eric Forth | 443 c1718 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that there are more nuts on this subject than on almost any other?
Christopher Chope | 443 c1718 (Link to this contribution) I hope that the insurance policy that we all have against defamation will protect my right hon. Frie...
Eric Forth | 443 c1716-7 (Link to this contribution) Yes of course, Madam Deputy Speaker, but it is useful to make the point as often as possible because...
Speaker | 443 c1718 (Link to this contribution) Order. May I bring the House back to the amendment under discussion?
Christopher Chope | 443 c1715 (Link to this contribution) Does my right hon. Friend share my concern that one of the problems, particularly with fuel cells, i...
Oliver Letwin | 443 c1714-5 (Link to this contribution) I am sorry to interrupt my right hon. Friend and I certainly do not intend to do so for more than 15...
Eric Forth | 443 c1714 (Link to this contribution) Ah, my right hon. Friend is about to help me.
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1716 (Link to this contribution) Would it not have been more helpful to the House if the Minister had said that at the beginning?
Eric Forth | 443 c1716 (Link to this contribution) I am extremely grateful to the Minister. Again, we see the remarkable value of this process of debat...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1716 (Link to this contribution) Perhaps I may clarify that point now. Amendments Nos. 51 and 52 do replicate the definition in the 2...
Eric Forth | 443 c1715-6 (Link to this contribution) I hesitate to get involved in technical details of the sort that my hon. Friend is suggesting, altho...
Eric Forth | 443 c1716 (Link to this contribution) Indeed it would; my hon. Friend is right. We are learning a lot of lessons today, which I hope will ...
Speaker | 443 c1716 (Link to this contribution) Order. Perhaps the debate on how or how not to legislate is for another day. Today we are discussing...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1728-9 (Link to this contribution) In addition to speaking to my amendment No. 32, I shall say a few words about the amendments tabled ...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1727-8 (Link to this contribution) I was talking about the range of possibilities. Some schemes could involve mini combined heat and po...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1727 (Link to this contribution) The technology would determine which section applied to the scheme. It could be a new school. I was ...
Eric Forth | 443 c1727 (Link to this contribution) It is important that we have this dialogue. Is the Minister saying that he believes that a photovolt...
Eric Forth | 443 c1727 (Link to this contribution) Can the Minister say a little more about what a large scheme might be in this context? We are talkin...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1729 (Link to this contribution) I am listening to my hon. Friend’s words with interest. Last time we discussed the Bill, we had the ...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1729 (Link to this contribution) I shall return to section 52(2)(a) of the Town and Country Planning Act 1990.
Christopher Chope | 443 c1725 (Link to this contribution) You have stolen my thunder, Madam Deputy Speaker, because I was going to say exactly the same thing....
Eric Forth | 443 c1725 (Link to this contribution) That was my reading of the Bill. Clause 9(6) explicitly says that a dwelling house"““does not includ...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1725 (Link to this contribution) My right hon. Friend is right. I shall not press the point any further, because I hope that when we ...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1725-6 (Link to this contribution) Would the Government not be in a better position to promote community energy schemes if they lowered...
Nigel Evans | 443 c1725 (Link to this contribution) In his discussion of microgeneration my hon. Friend has referred to wind power. I declare my interes...
Speaker | 443 c1725 (Link to this contribution) Order. The hon. Gentleman is straying into the debate on the next group of amendments.
Christopher Chope | 443 c1726 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is right. On 13 March, Ceres Power issued the following press release:"““Ceres Power,...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1726-7 (Link to this contribution) I certainly would not want to rehearse any arguments again, Madam Deputy Speaker. I hope that, havin...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1727 (Link to this contribution) With the leave of the House, I shall reply to one of the points that emerged in the latter stages of...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1724 (Link to this contribution) I do not understand my hon. Friend’s point. I am talking about 3.6kW of energy being used each year,...
Lord Whitehead | 443 c1724 (Link to this contribution) One is output, the other is capacity.
Christopher Chope | 443 c1723-4 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is long on assertions; I hope that he can justify the assertion that he has just made...
Lord Barker of Battle | 443 c1724 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend continues to labour under a misapprehension. We are referring to heat and electricity...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1724 (Link to this contribution) Maximum capacity, rather than the amount that is actually produced?
Christopher Chope | 443 c1724 (Link to this contribution) I am sorry, but because of the rustling of papers I could not hear what the hon. Gentleman said.
Christopher Chope | 443 c1724-5 (Link to this contribution) One could have a large power station with enormous capacity measured in gigawatts whose output is ve...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1721-2 (Link to this contribution) I absolutely agree, Madam Deputy Speaker, but you will have noticed that subsection (3) of Governmen...
Mark Lazarowicz | 443 c1722 (Link to this contribution) If we get on to the next group of amendments I hope that the hon. Gentleman and the hon. Member for ...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1722 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for that remark so far as it goes, but I had hoped that he would...
Eric Forth | 443 c1722 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend share my worry that if we get this wrong, we will face difficulties similar to t...
Speaker | 443 c1722 (Link to this contribution) Order. I warn the hon. Member for Christchurch (Mr. Chope) not to be tempted down the road of teleco...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1722-3 (Link to this contribution) I shall not be, Madam Deputy Speaker. However, when we discuss planning and development orders, anal...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1723 (Link to this contribution) Perhaps it will help the hon. Gentleman if I make it clear that the provision is designed to cover n...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1723 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the Minister for that intervention, but I am confused. Under clause 16 the maxima f...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1723 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend has stumbled across an important part of the Bill. If for simplicity we say that one ...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1723 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to my hon. Friend for making that point. I hope that our combined forces will prompt a...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1732 (Link to this contribution) I am saying that. My hon. Friend is right to draw attention to that concern. The clause makes it cle...
Nigel Evans | 443 c1732 (Link to this contribution) I have grave concerns about wind turbines for a number of reasons. In a number of countries where th...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1731-2 (Link to this contribution) My right hon. Friend is absolutely right. I shall come to the size of some of the plants, although w...
Eric Forth | 443 c1730-1 (Link to this contribution) I hope that, as my hon. Friend develops his argument—indeed, our hon. Friend the Member for Ketterin...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1730 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend makes an excellent point. I hope that he will contribute further to the debate in due...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1729 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend the Minister for Housing and Planning is in her constituency, where many of us would ...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1729 (Link to this contribution) I do, but perhaps the Minister did not expect us to reach this group of amendments so quickly. She m...
Speaker | 443 c1729 (Link to this contribution) Order. We are meeting on a Friday and we are discussing a particular set of amendments proposed by t...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1729 (Link to this contribution) I am glad the Government make provision for Ministers to attend the House on a Friday, because the G...
Eric Forth | 443 c1730 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend share my unease about the danger of making a presumption in favour of the abilit...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1730 (Link to this contribution) This is a very serious issue. If a planning application for 2,000 houses were made in my constituenc...
Eric Forth | 443 c1748 (Link to this contribution) I thought from what was said by the promoter and the hon. Member for Southampton, Test that that was...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1748 (Link to this contribution) Does my right hon. Friend think that the point being made by the hon. Member for Cambridge (David Ho...
David Howarth | 443 c1748 (Link to this contribution) Will the right hon. Gentleman tell the House how clause 9 changes anything in planning law so that a...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1752-3 (Link to this contribution) Does my right hon. Friend agree that one of the issues that the Minister has not addressed is the st...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1752 (Link to this contribution) The temptation for going is quite a strong one at this moment, so I do not regard those words as a t...
Speaker | 443 c1749 (Link to this contribution) Order. I have already made a ruling on telecommunications masts. Perhaps the right hon. Gentleman wo...
Eric Forth | 443 c1748-9 (Link to this contribution) In that case, we need not have the clause at all. The Minister could give us an undertaking and we c...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1752 (Link to this contribution) I was at pains when I spoke earlier to say that the amendment was unnecessary, because all the bodie...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1750-1 (Link to this contribution) Before my right hon. Friend moves on to his other amendments, will he address the concern that there...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1758 (Link to this contribution) I am not sure what deadline I have not met. The micropower strategy will be published by the end of ...
Lord Whitehead | 443 c1755 (Link to this contribution) It is subject to current planning law.
Lord Whitehead | 443 c1761 (Link to this contribution) As the right hon. Gentleman will imagine from the account I am giving, if the system is to work well...
Eric Forth | 443 c1760 (Link to this contribution) That is a very old-fashioned idea.
Lord Whitehead | 443 c1760 (Link to this contribution) This is another clause that originated in a Bill that, as the right hon. Member for Bromley and Chis...
Nigel Evans | 443 c1740 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend has used the word ““probably””. Is that not part of the problem? Is it not better to ...
Eric Forth | 443 c1737 (Link to this contribution) I plead guilty in that sense, but if we must have the clause—perhaps we will accept my hon. Friend’s...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1737-8 (Link to this contribution) I certainly agree, but I have another reservation about amendment No. 13. By specifying some factors...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1737 (Link to this contribution) Absolutely, and I was addressing my remarks to the expression ““have regard to”” in amendment No. 13...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1738-9 (Link to this contribution) My right hon. Friend is right, and it is why his amendment has more in its favour than it has agains...
Lord Barker of Battle | 443 c1740-1 (Link to this contribution) It would be worse because there would then be no compulsion on the Secretary of State to review the ...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1741 (Link to this contribution) I thought that it would be useful if I intervened at this stage. Amendment No. 32 would remove claus...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1741 (Link to this contribution) Let me continue by saying that the Office of the Deputy Prime Minister has been conducting a review ...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1741-2 (Link to this contribution) Does the Minister not understand that there is concern because of the definition of the capacity of ...
Nigel Evans | 443 c1742 (Link to this contribution) Does the Minister recognise that there are more and less controversial microgeneration plans? Small ...
Chris Huhne | 443 c1743 (Link to this contribution) I am certainly reassured by the Minister’s answers, especially on the point about consultation. Memb...
Lord Whitehead | 443 c1744-5 (Link to this contribution) Yes indeed, and that underlines my point that there is a boundary on permitted development orders th...
Chris Huhne | 443 c1743 (Link to this contribution) No, because I know that the right hon. Gentleman has a great interest in absorbing large amounts of ...
Mark Lazarowicz | 443 c1745 (Link to this contribution) Perhaps my hon. Friend would also confirm that special requirements under the procedure for permitte...
Lord Whitehead | 443 c1745 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is absolutely right. The same applies when we consider the safety of such devices. Th...
Lord Whitehead | 443 c1746 (Link to this contribution) We could indeed have an anti-regulatory measure whereby the red tape behind something that could be ...
Speaker | 443 c1747 (Link to this contribution) I should prefer it if the right hon. Gentleman addressed his remarks accordingly.
Eric Forth | 443 c1747 (Link to this contribution) It would not be as helpful as the hon. Gentleman might think. I can tell him that if I had been a me...
Nigel Evans | 443 c1736 (Link to this contribution) I shall, Madam Deputy Speaker. Does my hon. Friend agree that one of the most common problems that w...
Nigel Evans | 443 c1735-6 (Link to this contribution) The applications need to be considered before full planning, but not only for reasons of size, which...
Speaker | 443 c1736 (Link to this contribution) Order. Is the hon. Gentleman making an intervention or a speech? Perhaps he could bring his remarks ...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1735 (Link to this contribution) I am making the case. If the clause was not part of the Bill, putting microgenerating plant in one’s...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1737 (Link to this contribution) If one were in favour of permitted development orders, would not it appear extraordinary if blocks o...
Mark Lazarowicz | 443 c1736 (Link to this contribution) : The hon. Gentleman has invited me on a couple of occasions to give my views of what the Bill might...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1773-4 (Link to this contribution) I am not suggesting that we should have nuclear power stations, although nuclear generation would be...
Eric Forth | 443 c1775-6 (Link to this contribution) I assure my hon. Friend that I will not be browbeaten by eco-nuts, eco-fascists or any other odd peo...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1774-5 (Link to this contribution) As always, my right hon. Friend makes a fair point. We do not have parish councils in the metropolit...
Oliver Letwin | 443 c1773 (Link to this contribution) I hope my hon. Friend will accept that those of us who support the measure do not just want biomass ...
Mike Weir | 443 c1779 (Link to this contribution) Is the right hon. Gentleman not aware that that wording refers to a change in transmission charges f...
Eric Forth | 443 c1768-9 (Link to this contribution) Of course, but the worry is that Government amendment No. 49 seeks to leave out subsections (3) and ...
Chris Huhne | 443 c1768 (Link to this contribution) Does the right hon. Gentleman recognise that clause 17(3) states:"““Nothing in this section authoris...
Eric Forth | 443 c1767-8 (Link to this contribution) I am sure that we do, perhaps more frequently than I would like. By the very writing of such a claus...
Eric Forth | 443 c1767 (Link to this contribution) The answer to my hon. Friend is probably a moral duty.
Eric Forth | 443 c1767 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend spells out the reality of the parliamentary process. With the best will in the world,...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1767 (Link to this contribution) The explanation does not reassure me. The difficulty that I have is that the Bill will probably reac...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1773 (Link to this contribution) I accept that the clause would not affect the planning controls. What worries me is that it is entit...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1772 (Link to this contribution) I was disappointed with the Minister’s response to amendments Nos. 58 and 59. He said that the figur...
Eric Forth | 443 c1771 (Link to this contribution) It is the second time that the hon. Gentleman has mentioned the code of practice. Does he have any m...
Eric Forth | 443 c1764 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move amendment No. 75, in page 10, line 13, at end insert—
Chris Huhne | 443 c1763 (Link to this contribution) We, too, oppose these amendments, essentially because it seems to us that the clause already contain...
Lord Whitehead | 443 c1762 (Link to this contribution) If the report was sensible, it would difficult for it to have no regard to such issues. However, it ...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1763 (Link to this contribution) I will not comment on good Tory principles; it is hard enough to work out who are the good Tories in...
Eric Forth | 443 c1767 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the promoter of the Bill for that explanation. Nevertheless, I think that he would ...
Speaker | 443 c1765 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss the following amendments: No. 76, in page 10, line 25, at...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1766 (Link to this contribution) In my constituency of Kettering, major planning applications for thousands of houses are about to be...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1766 (Link to this contribution) I paid careful attention to my hon. Friend the Member for Bexhill and Battle (Gregory Barker), who h...
Mark Lazarowicz | 443 c1766 (Link to this contribution) A great deal of debate and public comment on the Bill has focused on microgeneration. Although that ...
Speaker | 443 c1734 (Link to this contribution) Order. We are discussing the amendment, which is about permitted development orders. We have already...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1732-3 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to my right hon. Friend for that intervention. I will indeed refer to his amendment, b...
Eric Forth | 443 c1732 (Link to this contribution) I can give some reassurance to my hon. Friend the Member for Ribble Valley (Mr. Evans). If he looks ...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1734 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is absolutely right. We normally find in terms of legislation that prevention is bett...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1734 (Link to this contribution) I am very supportive of wind power. A new wind farm in Kettering, Burton Wold, is providing electric...
Eric Forth | 443 c1733 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that those in the environmental lobby sometimes claim that they are the ma...
David Howarth | 443 c1748 (Link to this contribution) But the point is that nothing in clause 9 changes planning law at all. There is no such potential.
Eric Forth | 443 c1748 (Link to this contribution) We have a difficult choice to make. Either everything is hunky-dory and we do not need the provision...
David Howarth | 443 c1748 (Link to this contribution) The point of clause 9 is to place an obligation on the Minister to carry out a review that he alread...
Eric Forth | 443 c1747 (Link to this contribution) I was doing the Bill’s promoter the honour of answering his question, Madam Deputy Speaker, but if y...
Eric Forth | 443 c1747-8 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his explanation, but are we not talking about the possibilit...
Lord Whitehead | 443 c1747 (Link to this contribution) What I attempted to explain, perhaps not as well as I might have done, was that it would not be acce...
Eric Forth | 443 c1752 (Link to this contribution) The Minister should not be so eager to move on all the time. Obviously I have not said this often en...
Eric Forth | 443 c1752 (Link to this contribution) Of course I accept the kindness and integrity of the Minister, which are not in doubt, but Ministers...
Eric Forth | 443 c1749-50 (Link to this contribution) Indeed, Madam Deputy Speaker. Under the Bill, we face the prospect that devices such as solar panels...
Eric Forth | 443 c1758 (Link to this contribution) We are now getting to the exciting bit of the Bill: dynamic demand technologies. This is high-tech, ...
Speaker | 443 c1757-8 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss the following amendments: No. 73, in page 9, line 38, at...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1755 (Link to this contribution) But what is to stop someone bulk buying 50 generators, and then putting up 50 windmills? I accept th...
Eric Forth | 443 c1757 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move amendment No. 72, in page 9, line 27, after ‘Britain’, insert
Christopher Chope | 443 c1753-5 (Link to this contribution) We have had an excellent debate in which almost a record number of right hon. and hon. Members have ...
Eric Forth | 443 c1761 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his explanation. If the technology is that simple, if he kno...
Lord Whitehead | 443 c1760-1 (Link to this contribution) Clearly that is just a convention, not a requirement, and on this occasion it appears that the conve...
Eric Forth | 443 c1759-60 (Link to this contribution) Oh good, the hon. Gentleman will let me speculate for a while. In that case, I will. We have the po...
Eric Forth | 443 c1758-9 (Link to this contribution) In that case, I unreservedly apologise to the Minister. I misconstrued my hon. Friend. I unreservedl...
Eric Forth | 443 c1758 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend the Member for Christchurch (Mr. Chope), who has, as they say, done the maths, reckon...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1737 (Link to this contribution) Again, my hon. Friend makes an excellent point, which I hope the Minister will tackle. Why are block...
Speaker | 443 c1737 (Link to this contribution) Order. We have debated the Education and Inspections Bill. We are now debating the hon. Gentleman’s ...
Mark Lazarowicz | 443 c1739-40 (Link to this contribution) : I shall speak briefly. This part of the Bill originated in an amendment tabled in Committee, and w...
Lord Barker of Battle | 443 c1740 (Link to this contribution) : Although my hon. Friend the Member for Christchurch (Mr. Chope) spoke at great length, he expresse...
Lord Barker of Battle | 443 c1740 (Link to this contribution) That is a good point, but this is not enabling legislation. The clause simply asks the Minister to p...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1740 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to my hon. Friend for his kind comments about some of the points that I made. However,...
David Howarth | 443 c1741 (Link to this contribution) I wish to correct what the Minister has just said. Clause 9 would not ““allow”” such a review, becau...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1742 (Link to this contribution) Perhaps foolishly, I was applying a common-sense test to this. No one can anticipate that, following...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1742 (Link to this contribution) I understand the point that the hon. Gentleman makes. As colleagues are finding, progress and modern...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1742-3 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend encourages me to finish my speech. I have made the point that my colleague will write...
Lord Whitehead | 443 c1744 (Link to this contribution) Indeed, and might lead to other consequences. The provision suggests that the PDO mechanism does no...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1744 (Link to this contribution) Does the hon. Gentleman accept that, increasingly, local authorities will impose a condition on a pl...
Eric Forth | 443 c1743 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman give way?
Lord Barker of Battle | 443 c1745-6 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman has made a useful contribution to the debate and our understanding. To summarise,...
Eric Forth | 443 c1747 (Link to this contribution) I shall get around to it, Madam Deputy Speaker.
Eric Forth | 443 c1746 (Link to this contribution) I am sure that we are all grateful that it has been acknowledged that these debates have real use. S...
Mark Lazarowicz | 443 c1746-7 (Link to this contribution) The right hon. Gentleman will recall that earlier this week, in a Statutory Instrument Committee tha...
Speaker | 443 c1747 (Link to this contribution) Order. Is the right hon. Gentleman addressing his remarks to the amendment to which he is presumably...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1735 (Link to this contribution) My right hon. Friend asks about height. I am not sure whether I have much information about maximum ...
Eric Forth | 443 c1735 (Link to this contribution) I hope that my hon. Friend has not left the subject of size. For the benefit of us non-metric people...
Nick Hurd | 443 c1735 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend has framed this important argument excellently. However, is not he guilty of presumin...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1734 (Link to this contribution) The Minister is shaking his head before he has even heard what I am going to say. The article said t...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1734 (Link to this contribution) If clause 9 remains in the Bill, under a permitted development order it will be possible for all the...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1736-7 (Link to this contribution) That is a helpful point and I look forward to the hon. Gentleman’s contribution, to which I shall ha...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1736 (Link to this contribution) We have heard that the diameter of a 400W wind turbine is 1.1m and that that of a 1kW wind turbine i...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1736 (Link to this contribution) I shall give way to my hon. Friend.
Christopher Chope | 443 c1736 (Link to this contribution) I hope that we shall get closer to an answer to that pertinent point. Whatever the size, we know tha...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1736 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to my hon. Friend for that intervention. We know that neighbour disputes can end in vi...
Speaker | 443 c1736 (Link to this contribution) Order. The hon. Gentleman has made his point.
Speaker | 443 c1736 (Link to this contribution) Order. We do not need to hear about the hon. Gentleman’s frustrations in a previous life.
Eric Forth | 443 c1774 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend has parishes in his constituency, but I do not, because my constituency is in a Londo...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1774 (Link to this contribution) I cannot generalise, but Burton parish council, for example, has one part-time clerk and tries to me...
Oliver Letwin | 443 c1773 (Link to this contribution) I see the force of my hon. Friend’s argument, but I understand that his favoured method of generatio...
Mark Lazarowicz | 443 c1778 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That the Bill be now read the Third time. I am glad that Members have co-operated to...
Eric Forth | 443 c1774 (Link to this contribution) Does that not mean that there is a risk that the alleged benefits of microgeneration will be unevenl...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1773 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful for that intervention, because it returns me to a major issue for my constituents. The...
Eric Forth | 443 c1779 (Link to this contribution) I look forward to hearing the hon. Gentleman seeking to contribute to the Third Reading debate and t...
Eric Forth | 443 c1778 (Link to this contribution) This is the bit we have all been looking forward to, because I hope that with your permission, Mr. D...
Philip Hollobone | 443 c1779 (Link to this contribution) My right hon. Friend referred to the international context for the Bill. On 12 January, I received a...
Eric Forth | 443 c1779 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to my hon. Friend, and later in my remarks I shall quote further from the Prime Minist...
Martin Horwood | 443 c1769 (Link to this contribution) The right hon. Gentleman is taking up a great deal of our time speculating on what the Minister migh...
Eric Forth | 443 c1769 (Link to this contribution) No doubt the hon. Gentleman thinks that he is being very clever and helping the process, but he has ...
Lord Barker of Battle | 443 c1767 (Link to this contribution) Do we in the House legislate for moral duties?
Lord Barker of Battle | 443 c1767 (Link to this contribution) Can my right hon. Friend specify which part of the clause imposes a duty on a parish council? It sta...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1769-70 (Link to this contribution) I am sorry, but I am losing my voice; I trust that it is contagious. Amendment No. 75 lists a numbe...
Malcolm Wicks | 443 c1772 (Link to this contribution) It may help if I give an example. I am advised that the university of Edinburgh halls of residence h...
Mark Lazarowicz | 443 c1772 (Link to this contribution) Of all the exaggerations, the idea of a 1,000 m rotor, which is the logical conclusion of the hon. G...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1772 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the Minister for intervening. If the university already has such a plant, I cannot ...
Chris Huhne | 443 c1771 (Link to this contribution) I agree with the hon. Member for Bexhill and Battle (Gregory Barker). We are happy with the consulta...
Lord Barker of Battle | 443 c1770-1 (Link to this contribution) The final group contains an interesting range of amendments. My right hon. Friend the Member for Bro...
Eric Forth | 443 c1764 (Link to this contribution) Hon. Members present will know that there is a well worn technique called the probing amendment, and...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1763-4 (Link to this contribution) My right hon. Friend the Member for Bromley and Chislehurst (Mr. Forth) has done the House a service...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1761 (Link to this contribution) Does the hon. Gentleman accept that such a report should include the provisions that my right hon. F...
Lord Barker of Battle | 443 c1762 (Link to this contribution) I daresay that it would. I am sure that the question of new fit or retrofit costs—my right hon. Frie...
Lord Barker of Battle | 443 c1762 (Link to this contribution) The whole House has benefited from the short talk on dynamic demand technology by the hon. Member fo...
Mark Lazarowicz | 443 c1767 (Link to this contribution) Indeed. The clause could facilitate district heating schemes, but it would not change the planning r...
Eric Forth | 443 c1767 (Link to this contribution) Once again, I am grateful. I do not know whether that reassures my hon. Friend the Member for Ketter...
Eric Forth | 443 c1765-6 (Link to this contribution) It is always a pleasure to have one’s modest amendments grouped with Government amendments. It reinf...
Eric Forth | 443 c1766 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is perfectly correct to ask that question, which is relevant not just to his constitu...
Eric Forth | 443 c1766 (Link to this contribution) That leads me to ask whether—and I make no apologies for the circular nature of our debate—a plant t...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1719 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend brings substantial expertise to the debate.
Speaker | 443 c1728 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss the following amendments: No. 13, in page 6, line 25 [Cl...
Lord Whitehead | 443 c1724 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman is talking about household electricity use, which is output. In the context of th...
Lord Whitehead | 443 c1743-4 (Link to this contribution) The purpose of the clause, as the hon. Member for Bexhill and Battle (Gregory Barker) has already su...
Eric Forth | 443 c1762 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend think that only new appliances will be fitted with the device costing a few penn...
Eric Forth | 443 c1711-2 (Link to this contribution) I am most grateful to the hon. Gentleman. I shall accept his explanation and move on as a small rewa...
Chris Huhne | 443 c1709 (Link to this contribution) The Liberal Democrats also regard the amendments as drafting measures. The Bill has our full support...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1728 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move amendment No. 32, in page 6, line 15, leave out Clause 9.
Speaker | 443 c1726 (Link to this contribution) Order. The hon. Gentleman is rehearsing arguments that we have already heard.
Christopher Chope | 443 c1733-4 (Link to this contribution) That is the case with some of them, but not all. If my right hon. Friend had read the open debate in...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1729-30 (Link to this contribution) Section 52(2)(a) of the Town and Country Planning Act 1990 refers to a development order, which"““it...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1758 (Link to this contribution) I certainly did not intend to suggest that the Minister had not met his deadline. If he delivers by ...
Eric Forth | 443 c1738 (Link to this contribution) In a sense, the discussion takes us back to the debate on sources of energy and the list that we con...
Mark Lazarowicz | 443 c1742 (Link to this contribution) An earlier intervention from the Opposition Back Benches suggested that the review might be carried ...
Eric Forth | 443 c1714 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to my hon. Friend for raising that point. What worries me about the approach that has ...
Eric Forth | 443 c1715 (Link to this contribution) Indeed. I was merely trying to clarify whether it was felt that the technology that I briefly descri...
Speaker | 443 c1729 (Link to this contribution) Order. Interesting and controversial the regional spatial strategy might be, but it is not relevant ...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1730 (Link to this contribution) That is absolutely right; it is the dilemma that I am hoping the majority of Members of the House wi...
Eric Forth | 443 c1748 (Link to this contribution) I am sure that if they were not relevant, Madam Deputy Speaker would see to that. She does not need ...
Eric Forth | 443 c1751-2 (Link to this contribution) Indeed. My hon. Friend makes an important point. Necessarily, this is all rather speculative. We hav...
Christopher Chope | 443 c1755-6 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman comes at me with these short statements. He thinks that permitted development rig...
Chris Huhne | 443 c1771-2 (Link to this contribution) The ministerial code is a little beyond the purview of the debate, suffice it to say that there is a...
Lord Barker of Battle | 443 c1723 (Link to this contribution) I think that everyone here is labouring under a misapprehension. I understand that the average house...
Eric Forth | 443 c1753 (Link to this contribution) Indeed. We know of many occasions on which so-called consultation has been carried out in such a per...
Subjects
Combined heat and power Climate change Environment protection Energy Electricity generation Ofgem Planning Scotland Wind power Carbon emissions Fuel cells
Legislation
Climate Change and Sustainable Energy Bill 2005-06
Link
View this Parliamentary proceeding on www.publications.parliament.uk