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Debate on bill on Monday, 8 May 2006, in the House of Commons.

Civil Aviation Bill 2005-06

Civil Aviation Bill. Programme motion (No 2) on consideration of Lords amendments and subsequent stages. Agreed to on question (formal). Consideration of Lords amendments. Lords amendments 3, 6 to 10, 12 agreed to. Lords amendments 1, 2, 4, 5, 11 disagreed to, with an amendment in lieu made for amendments 5 and 11. Committee appointed to draw up Reasons for disagreement. Reason reported and agreed to. Message sent to Lords to communicate Reason, with Bill and amendments.

Secondary information

Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
446 c40-88 
Session
2005-06
Department
Department for Transport
Legislative stage
Lords amendments
Procedure
Programme motions
Chamber / Committee
House of Commons chamber
Related items
Civil Aviation Bill. Lords amendments.
Tuesday, 28 March 2006
Bills
House of Commons
Aviation: Night Flying Restrictions
Tuesday, 6 June 2006
Written statements
House of Lords
Proceeding contributions
John McDonnell | 446 c81 (Link to this contribution) Can my hon. Friend just clarify the geographical basis of the recent study, the samples that were ta...
Derek Twigg | 446 c81 (Link to this contribution) I have not got that information to hand, but I will write to my hon. Friend following the debate. T...
Show all contributions (147)
Derek Twigg | 446 c85 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That the House agrees with the Lords in the said amendment.
Speaker | 446 c85 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss Lords amendment No. 7.
Derek Twigg | 446 c80-1 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend makes an important point about the disbenefits of air pollution. He may be aware that...
Derek Twigg | 446 c86 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That the House agrees with the Lords in the said amendment.
Speaker | 446 c85 (Link to this contribution) Order. I am sorry to interrupt the Minister. Could hon. Members not have conversations in the Chambe...
Derek Twigg | 446 c85 (Link to this contribution) These amendments make two minor changes to the consultation requirement that subsection (5) of new s...
Julian Brazier | 446 c86 (Link to this contribution) We have no objection to these minor amendments. Lords amendment agreed to. Lords amendment No. 7 a...
Derek Twigg | 446 c85-6 (Link to this contribution) The first of the amendments remedies that omission. It does so using the formulation,"““any body app...
Patrick Mercer | 446 c87-8 (Link to this contribution) I was going to intervene, but if the Minister has finished, I will make a quick response. I was inte...
Speaker | 446 c86 (Link to this contribution) With this it be will convenient to discuss Lords amendments Nos. 9,10 and 12.
Derek Twigg | 446 c86-7 (Link to this contribution) The Government gave notice of their intention to make these amendments to the Bill in a written stat...
Lord Garnier | 446 c58 (Link to this contribution) The Minister talked about local decisions, an expression also used by his five or six predecessors, ...
Derek Twigg | 446 c58 (Link to this contribution) It is important that airports listen to concerns raised by people affected by flights from them and ...
Lord Redwood | 446 c58 (Link to this contribution) If the Minister does not want to use the route suggested in the Lords amendment, is he telling the H...
Derek Twigg | 446 c58 (Link to this contribution) The right hon. Gentleman will have heard what I just said about the EU emissions trading scheme. We ...
Graham Stringer | 446 c58-9 (Link to this contribution) I have been following my hon. Friend’s argument closely and I agree that it is better for decisions ...
Derek Twigg | 446 c59 (Link to this contribution) I thank my hon. Friend for his comments and recognise his experience, interest and work in aviation....
Lembit Opik | 446 c56-7 (Link to this contribution) I rise to seek the Government’s position on general aviation, particularly British general aviation,...
Derek Twigg | 446 c57 (Link to this contribution) We have had an interesting and enlightening debate for my first run-out on the subject of aviation a...
Mark Todd | 446 c57 (Link to this contribution) Can my hon. Friend explain why the apparent fault in placing an additional regulatory burden on—pres...
Derek Twigg | 446 c57 (Link to this contribution) We have to make a judgment about the balance of the burden and what sort of guidance we issue to air...
Martin Linton | 446 c60 (Link to this contribution) Although I agree with my hon. Friend the Member for Lewisham, Deptford (Joan Ruddock) that the best ...
Derek Twigg | 446 c60-1 (Link to this contribution) If my hon. Friend will bear with me, I will come to those issues. Lords amendment No. 5 removes sub...
Joan Ruddock | 446 c60 (Link to this contribution) May I put it to my hon. Friend that, although it would be ideal if all aircraft were much quieter, t...
Derek Twigg | 446 c60 (Link to this contribution) I understand my hon. Friend’s concerns. As she says, there is a view generally about not wanting nig...
David Leslie Taylor | 446 c61 (Link to this contribution) Does the Minister agree that the system is horrendously complex? So far, for instance, our Governmen...
Alan Simpson | 446 c59 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to my hon. Friend for drawing the distinction between decisions that need to be made l...
Speaker | 446 c60 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss Lords amendment 11 and the Government motion to disagree ...
Derek Twigg | 446 c60 (Link to this contribution) Clause 2 amends section 78 of the Civil Aviation Act 1982, which enables the Secretary of State to t...
Derek Twigg | 446 c59 (Link to this contribution) Again, I understand the issue that my hon. Friend raises. He mentions the European Commission and th...
Derek Twigg | 446 c60 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That this House disagrees with the Lords in the said amendment.
Alan Simpson | 446 c56 (Link to this contribution) I would rather have an amendment with defective wording than no amendment at all. As was pointed out...
Alan Simpson | 446 c55 (Link to this contribution) I suspect that there is a broad consensus in all parts of the House on the need to sort out the prob...
Julian Brazier | 446 c56 (Link to this contribution) On the hon. Gentleman’s earlier point, although we are strongly in favour of the amendment’s substan...
Alan Simpson | 446 c55 (Link to this contribution) Precisely. I did not want to speak at this stage about the next group of amendments, which refer spe...
Lord Redwood | 446 c55 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman can see the problem very clearly, as can I and many of my right hon. and hon. Fri...
Alan Simpson | 446 c54-5 (Link to this contribution) I also congratulate my hon. Friend on the expansion of his ministerial remit. I hope that the additi...
Justine Greening | 446 c55 (Link to this contribution) The situation that the hon. Gentleman describes is not hypothetical. That is exactly what is being p...
Keith Vaz | 446 c52-3 (Link to this contribution) The hon. and learned Gentleman is right: there is great concern in Leicester and Leicestershire abou...
Lord Garnier | 446 c53-4 (Link to this contribution) As ever, I am grateful for any compliments from wherever they come. On such a subject, to have a com...
Lord Garnier | 446 c52 (Link to this contribution) I will allow the hon. Gentleman to intervene briefly, before putting a point to the Minister and con...
Lord Garnier | 446 c50-1 (Link to this contribution) I am sorry that the hon. Member for Luton, North (Kelvin Hopkins) will acquiesce with what his Whips...
Kelvin Hopkins | 446 c51 (Link to this contribution) The hon. and learned Gentleman seems to making a case for the municipalisation of all airports so th...
Lord Garnier | 446 c51 (Link to this contribution) Not only was I not seeming to make that case, but I was not making it. I am asking the Government to...
Mark Todd | 446 c51-2 (Link to this contribution) Although I have a lot of sympathy with the hon. and learned Gentleman’s point, does he agree that th...
Lord Garnier | 446 c52 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman makes a different but none the less good argument. I am arguing that the Bill, un...
Lord Garnier | 446 c52 (Link to this contribution) I see that the former director would like to intervene.
Lord Garnier | 446 c52 (Link to this contribution) I am not sure that that is true. It may well be that from the safety of Manchester, Blackley, the nu...
Julian Brazier | 446 c49 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman clarify his response to the previous intervention? Not only are the aggregat...
Kelvin Hopkins | 446 c50 (Link to this contribution) I thank the hon. Gentleman for his intervention. I wanted to respond to the intervention made by my ...
Graham Stringer | 446 c49 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend and I have shared a similar point of view in many aviation debates. Does he accept, h...
Kelvin Hopkins | 446 c49 (Link to this contribution) I agree entirely; I simply want to offer the industry incentives to do better.
John McDonnell | 446 c49 (Link to this contribution) Emissions might be decreasing where airports are not expanding. However, where airports are expandin...
Kelvin Hopkins | 446 c49 (Link to this contribution) Indeed. Anyone who lives near an airport will suffer in that respect, and there is everything to be ...
Lembit Opik | 446 c48 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that the smaller airports are something of a red herring because it is obv...
Alistair Carmichael | 446 c48 (Link to this contribution) I am delighted to tell the right hon. Gentleman that I have no idea what the figure would be. As Min...
Kelvin Hopkins | 446 c49 (Link to this contribution) I shall speak briefly. I should declare an interest because London Luton airport brings considerable...
Alistair Carmichael | 446 c48-9 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is uncharacteristically restrained when he says ““something of a red herring””, becau...
Lord Redwood | 446 c48 (Link to this contribution) What do the Liberal Democrats believe to be the minimum charge that one would have to impose on airc...
John McDonnell | 446 c46-7 (Link to this contribution) I welcome my hon. Friends the Member for (Derek Twigg) and for Lincoln (Gillian Merron) to the Front...
Alistair Carmichael | 446 c47-8 (Link to this contribution) I, too, welcome the Under-Secretaries to their new responsibilities. I have previously worked with t...
Gwyneth Dunwoody | 446 c45 (Link to this contribution) Has the hon. Gentleman noticed that it is usually the case that the bigger the airport, particularly...
Julian Brazier | 446 c45-6 (Link to this contribution) I agree with the hon. Lady on that point, but I am concerned about cross-subsidy between airports in...
Lord Redwood | 446 c45 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend has been following these matters with previous Ministers. Can he tell me what the Gov...
Julian Brazier | 446 c45 (Link to this contribution) I would dearly love to be able to answer my right hon. Friend’s question, but the answer is very lit...
Julian Brazier | 446 c43-4 (Link to this contribution) May I begin by welcoming the hon. Member for Halton (Derek Twigg) to the Chamber and, indeed, the ho...
Derek Twigg | 446 c43 (Link to this contribution) I am about to conclude, I am afraid. I urge hon. Members to accept Lords amendment No. 3.
Derek Twigg | 446 c41 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That this House disagrees with the Lords in the said amendment.
Speaker | 446 c41 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to consider Lords amendment No. 2 and the Government motion to disag...
Derek Twigg | 446 c41 (Link to this contribution) Lords amendment No. 1 was made by the Lords in the belief that aerodrome operators would not volunta...
Julian Brazier | 446 c41-2 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the Minister for giving way so early in his speech, but astonished by what he has j...
Derek Twigg | 446 c42 (Link to this contribution) I was trying to make a comparison between larger and smaller airports and different classes of aircr...
Lord Garnier | 446 c42 (Link to this contribution) I note that proposed new subsection (3) of section 38 of the 1982 Act refers to ““taking off or land...
Derek Twigg | 446 c42-3 (Link to this contribution) I do not think that that is the case, but I will confirm the correct position to the hon. and learne...
Derek Twigg | 446 c76 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Members for Richmond Park (Susan Kramer) and for Windsor have already tried to argue that t...
John McDonnell | 446 c76 (Link to this contribution) The World Health Organisation states that we should cover both. Its guidelines for noise levels stat...
Julian Brazier | 446 c77 (Link to this contribution) Does the Under-Secretary accept that even if there are some disagreements in the literature about th...
Derek Twigg | 446 c77-8 (Link to this contribution) I hope that the hon. Gentleman will bear with me while I finish this point. My hon. Friend the Memb...
Kelvin Hopkins | 446 c78 (Link to this contribution) I am interested to hear what my hon. Friend is saying, but has not the point been made by Opposition...
Derek Twigg | 446 c78 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend makes an important point, which other hon. Members have also raised. Different people...
Adam Afriyie | 446 c75 (Link to this contribution) Let me ask the Under-Secretary a fairly straightforward question. Does the Bill allow increased nigh...
Justine Greening | 446 c75-6 (Link to this contribution) The Under-Secretary is possibly right—and neither he nor his Government will be around when the Bill...
Derek Twigg | 446 c75 (Link to this contribution) Unless I am mistaken—I am happy to explain if it is not the case—the Government can examine the posi...
John McDonnell | 446 c74 (Link to this contribution) As my hon. Friend is new to this brief I would like to mention the historical record of the past 40 ...
Derek Twigg | 446 c74 (Link to this contribution) I know that my hon. Friend campaigns strongly on issues about which he is concerned on behalf of his...
Derek Twigg | 446 c74 (Link to this contribution) I understand the hon. Gentleman’s point, but it is important to bear in mind the balance that can be...
Baroness Kramer | 446 c75 (Link to this contribution) The Under-Secretary has mentioned economic benefit several times. I received a written answer from a...
John McDonnell | 446 c74 (Link to this contribution) The simple point that I am making is that one decision in favour of the local community and the loca...
Derek Twigg | 446 c75 (Link to this contribution) I am sure that my hon. Friend will not be surprised to learn that I do not agree with that. He comme...
Derek Twigg | 446 c73-4 (Link to this contribution) I listened carefully to what hon. Members said about disturbance and so forth, and I understand thei...
Justine Greening | 446 c72-3 (Link to this contribution) I have indeed considered that. One of my questions for the Minister was this: can local councils use...
John McDonnell | 446 c79-80 (Link to this contribution) While my hon. Friend has the opportunity to expand on the matters relating to the amendment, may I p...
Speaker | 446 c80 (Link to this contribution) Order. Even in the current conditions, that was a long intervention.
Oliver Heald | 446 c79 (Link to this contribution) The Minister has given the House an assurance today that the limit on night flights at Heathrow will...
Derek Twigg | 446 c79 (Link to this contribution) I am not criticising the hon. Gentleman, because I know that he is concerned about these matters, bu...
Speaker | 446 c79 (Link to this contribution) Order. I certainly think that the debate should be confined to civil aviation, and the Minister shou...
Derek Twigg | 446 c79 (Link to this contribution) I am very much aware that you have a great interest not only in this subject but in railways,Mr. Dep...
Derek Twigg | 446 c79 (Link to this contribution) Is the hon. Gentleman referring to the journalists outside the Committee Room, or to what is going o...
Julian Brazier | 446 c78 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful for the opportunity to be able to refresh the Minister a little. Will he tell the Hous...
Derek Twigg | 446 c78 (Link to this contribution) I just want to say to hon. Members that there is growing interest in this debate on both sides of th...
Derek Twigg | 446 c64 (Link to this contribution) The hon. and learned Gentleman spends a lot of time on this subject and has a great deal of knowledg...
Lord Garnier | 446 c64 (Link to this contribution) Clearly the Minister and the Government as a whole think that designation under the 1982 Act is a go...
Adam Afriyie | 446 c64 (Link to this contribution) Why is the Minister dressing up the Government’s amendment as a concession? It seems to me that when...
Derek Twigg | 446 c63 (Link to this contribution) I do not accept that. It is important that we consider how we can manage the situation in the best p...
Derek Twigg | 446 c63 (Link to this contribution) I will give way to the hon. Gentleman, but would like to make some progress because I have been gene...
Derek Twigg | 446 c63 (Link to this contribution) I have made it clear that that will apply to Heathrow. We will communicate our intentions on Gatwick...
Julian Brazier | 446 c63 (Link to this contribution) The Minister has indeed been generous, so I thank him for letting me intervene. Will he just clarify...
Derek Twigg | 446 c63-4 (Link to this contribution) If the hon. and learned Gentleman does not mind, I would like to make some progress with my speech. ...
Baroness Kramer | 446 c63 (Link to this contribution) Does the Minister not understand that from the perspective of someone under the flight path, the num...
Derek Twigg | 446 c63 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friends the Members for Brentford and Isleworth (Ann Keen), for Feltham and Heston (Alan Kee...
Ann Keen | 446 c62 (Link to this contribution) I thank the Minister and, especially, the Government for listening to my constituents. The concessio...
Derek Twigg | 446 c62 (Link to this contribution) What we think is appropriate is a matter of balance. There is obviously a difference of opinion abou...
Baroness Kramer | 446 c61 (Link to this contribution) Does the Minister not understand that saying, ““Trust me,”” is not a satisfactory answer to people i...
Derek Twigg | 446 c61 (Link to this contribution) I understand what my hon. Friend is saying, but it is important to have a number of tools at our dis...
Justine Greening | 446 c62 (Link to this contribution) I fail to understand how the Minister’s argument stacks up. Surely keeping two locks on the Secretar...
Derek Twigg | 446 c62 (Link to this contribution) We can argue about whether people want us to legislate now, leave things open, or have more discreti...
Lord Redwood | 446 c62 (Link to this contribution) I am extremely grateful to the Minister for that assurance, which will reassure my constituents. How...
Derek Twigg | 446 c61-2 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady has made a point that other hon. Members have made, but clearly the Government have se...
Lord Randall of Uxbridge | 446 c72 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend think that there would be any merit in trying to get an antisocial behaviour ord...
Derek Twigg | 446 c72 (Link to this contribution) Will the hon. Gentleman tell me whether he supports my earlier announcement on Heathrow up to 2012?
Adam Afriyie | 446 c70-2 (Link to this contribution) As I am the Member of Parliament for Windsor, thousands of my constituents live under flight paths, ...
Justine Greening | 446 c72 (Link to this contribution) My constituents, especially those who live close to the river and are worst affected by night-time, ...
Adam Afriyie | 446 c72 (Link to this contribution) In an earlier intervention, the Minister asked the hon. Member for Richmond Park (Susan Kramer) exac...
Alistair Carmichael | 446 c69 (Link to this contribution) No; I am opposed to the Minister’s coming to the House and pretending that his concession is a case ...
David Wilshire | 446 c70 (Link to this contribution) I apologise to the Minister because I was not present for his opening comments—I was trying to extra...
Alistair Carmichael | 446 c70 (Link to this contribution) We were going to get it anyway, so I have no difficulty with it. However, I have difficulty with yet...
Derek Twigg | 446 c69 (Link to this contribution) Is the hon. Gentleman opposed to the Government’s setting a limit till 2012, as I announced today?
Alistair Carmichael | 446 c69 (Link to this contribution) I cannot but agree. The Minister’s so-called concession today was greeted with justifiable ridicule....
Baroness Kramer | 446 c69 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that there is no logic to the proposal that a particular set of limits sho...
Alistair Carmichael | 446 c69 (Link to this contribution) It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Hayes and Harlington (John McDonnell), who says that ...
John McDonnell | 446 c68-9 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady will agree that if consultation means anything, it must mean that the Government liste...
Justine Greening | 446 c68 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman makes an excellent point. Is he aware that councils representing 2.3 million peop...
John McDonnell | 446 c67-8 (Link to this contribution) I am not just disappointed with the Government’s attitude towards Lords amendmentNo. 5; I am ashamed...
Julian Brazier | 446 c66-7 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend’s ingenious analogy shows how weak is the system, which will be the only way of contr...
Justine Greening | 446 c66 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that the problem with the Leq measurement partly stems from the fact that ...
Julian Brazier | 446 c64-6 (Link to this contribution) On Second Reading, in Committee and in another place, our Front-Bench spokesmen stated that the time...
Derek Twigg | 446 c64 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman is entitled to his opinion, but he will have heard from my hon. Friends that my a...
Graham Stringer | 446 c52 (Link to this contribution) As ever, I am listening carefully to the hon. and learned Gentleman’s argument, which seems to be ba...
Lord Randall of Uxbridge | 446 c74 (Link to this contribution) Does the Minister think that reversing the Lords amendments will benefit people or commercial intere...
Derek Twigg | 446 c70 (Link to this contribution) Is the hon. Gentleman in favour of it?
Derek Twigg | 446 c76-7 (Link to this contribution) I understand my hon. Friend’s point about World Health Organisation standards. Let me consider that ...
Derek Twigg | 446 c75 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady makes a good point about arguments for economic benefits and the social and environmen...
Subjects
Aviation Air pollution Airports Finance Fees and charges Environment protection Heathrow Airport Noise Night flying Regulation East Midlands Airport
Legislation
Civil Aviation Bill 2005-06
Link
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