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Committee of the Whole House (HL) and Debate on bill on Monday, 20 April 2009, in the House of Lords.

Postal Services Bill [HL]

Postal Services Bill (HL). Lords Committee stage third day. Clauses 20 to 33 agreed to.

Secondary information

Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
709 c1276-322,1335-58 
Session
2008-09
Department
Department for Work and Pensions
Legislative stage
Committee stage
Procedure
New clauses
Chamber / Committee
House of Lords chamber
Related items
Proceeding contributions
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1292-3 (Link to this contribution) The amendment tries to get a single scheme for tax purposes. First, I am advised that the current ba...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1292 (Link to this contribution) Clause 22: Taxation Amendment 77 77: Clause 22, page 11, line 41, at end insert— "(5A) Regulations...
Show all contributions (95)
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 709 c1294-6 (Link to this contribution) I think that the understanding of the noble Lord, Lord De Mauley, on the clause is a little misplace...
Lord De Mauley | 709 c1293-4 (Link to this contribution) The noble Lord, Lord Clarke, has highlighted another complication that might fall on pensioners as a...
Lord De Mauley | 709 c1296 (Link to this contribution) Clause 23: Information Amendment 77A 77A: Clause 23, page 12, line 15, after "otherwise)" insert "...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1296 (Link to this contribution) I am left with a feeling that my noble friend has been helpful, although I shall not become too euph...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 709 c1297-8 (Link to this contribution) Before I deal with the amendment, I wish to deal with the question that the noble Lord raised about ...
Lord De Mauley | 709 c1296-7 (Link to this contribution) Our final amendment on Part 2 from these Benches is very simple and I hope can be dealt with quickly...
Lord De Mauley | 709 c1292 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the Minister for his response. I would like the chance to think a little more about...
Lord De Mauley | 709 c1298 (Link to this contribution) I hear what the Minister says, although I believe that there is precedent for including these words....
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 709 c1300-3 (Link to this contribution) This has been an interesting, if somewhat compacted, debate. Let me try to unpick one or two issues....
Lord Whitty | 709 c1300 (Link to this contribution) I will intervene in the debate with a word of advice to the Government. If they want to avoid some o...
Lord De Mauley | 709 c1299 (Link to this contribution) The noble Lord, Lord Clarke, returns to the question of the Secretary of State amending the RMPP wit...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1304 (Link to this contribution) I thank my noble friend for that comment. He draws attention to Clause 24, which deals with orders a...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 709 c1303-4 (Link to this contribution) I think that sometimes in this discourse we are in danger of interchanging consent and consultation....
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1303 (Link to this contribution) I thank my noble friend for that very informative response to this short debate. He started by sayin...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1298-9 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 78A is really a rehash of my amendment to Clause 18. I said then that any amendment to the...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1298 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 78A 78A: Clause 24, page 12, line 21, at end insert— "(1A) The Secretary of State may not...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1281-2 (Link to this contribution) Although my name is not on the amendment, the name of my noble friend Lady Turner is and, in support...
Lord Hoyle | 709 c1281 (Link to this contribution) What I have to say in relation to this amendment is very simple. Where the Bill states that: ""The S...
Lord De Mauley | 709 c1282-3 (Link to this contribution) The amendment raises some important concerns about what the Government propose will happen to the as...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 709 c1280-1 (Link to this contribution) I am happy to try to place as much on the record as I can to give my noble friend the quite reasonab...
Lord Hoyle | 709 c1281 (Link to this contribution) Clause 20: Transfer of assets of the RMPP Amendment 70A 70A: Clause 20, page 10, line 31, leave ou...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1281 (Link to this contribution) I thank my noble friend for that further clarification. If I have understood him aright, and I am no...
Lord Hoyle | 709 c1285 (Link to this contribution) This is a probing amendment and I desire to go over in detail what my noble friend has said. We may ...
Lord De Mauley | 709 c1285 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 72 72: Clause 20, page 10, line 41, at end insert— "( ) The Secretary of State must infor...
Lord De Mauley | 709 c1285 (Link to this contribution) The amendments in this group address two concerns. Amendment 72 deals with which of the RMPP’s asset...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1288-90 (Link to this contribution) This group includes Amendments 74 and 76. In Amendment 74, I am saying: ""The power of the Secretary...
Lord De Mauley | 709 c1288 (Link to this contribution) Once again, the noble Lord, Lord Clarke, who spoke earlier about trust, like us appears to have simi...
Lord De Mauley | 709 c1288 (Link to this contribution) Clause 21: Restriction on power to transfer assets Amendment 73 73: Clause 21, page 11, line 4, le...
Lord De Mauley | 709 c1288 (Link to this contribution) I am most grateful to the Minister. I am also grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Razzall, who, as alwa...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 709 c1286-8 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful for what I take to be a measure of support from the noble Lord. The reason for adoptin...
Lord Razzall | 709 c1286 (Link to this contribution) When the Minister winds up on this point, will he explain why the Government are simply not agreeing...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 709 c1286 (Link to this contribution) I start by responding to the latter point made by the noble Lord, Lord Razzall. While I cannot, perh...
Lord Hoyle | 709 c1290 (Link to this contribution) I rise to support my noble friend. What we are on about here is the members and trying to protect th...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 709 c1290-2 (Link to this contribution) I will again do all I can to try to make sure that on the record we give the assurances that I belie...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1280 (Link to this contribution) I thank the noble Lord, Lord De Mauley, and the Minister for their comments. When dealing with this ...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 709 c1278-80 (Link to this contribution) Part 2 of the Bill sets out the Government’s proposals to address the deficit in the Royal Mail pens...
Lord De Mauley | 709 c1278 (Link to this contribution) When the Minister responds, will he clarify whether the circumstances contemplated by proposed new p...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1276-8 (Link to this contribution) First, I declare my interest. I do not want to repeat it because it is on the record, but I was a Po...
Lord Whitty | 709 c1310 (Link to this contribution) As the noble Lord has asked the question, perhaps I can respond briefly. My point is that there need...
Lord Hunt of Wirral | 709 c1309-10 (Link to this contribution) In intervening for the first time today, I remind noble Lords of my interests as set out in the Regi...
Lord Whitty | 709 c1308-9 (Link to this contribution) I also support my noble friend in this amendment or something very like it. I declare an interest as...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1311 (Link to this contribution) Will my noble friend get this right? They are post buses, not Post Office vans, and they are constru...
Lord Carter of Barnes | 709 c1311 (Link to this contribution) I thank my noble friends for tabling the amendment. Before we delve into the detailed amendments, of...
Lord Hunt of Wirral | 709 c1310-1 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the noble Lord for that explanation. It highlights the fact that we are now dealing...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1305-7 (Link to this contribution) We now move on to a series of amendments dealing with the duty of the future regulator. Amendment 80...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1305 (Link to this contribution) Clause 28: Duty to secure provision of universal postal service Amendment 80 80: Clause 28, page 1...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1304-5 (Link to this contribution) My old employers used to say that that sort of argument was the salami treatment, cutting one slice ...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1315 (Link to this contribution) I thank my noble friend very much for that. But, quite seriously, will we always have this benevolen...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1315-7 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 81 deals with access points, to which my noble friend Lord Whitty referred at Second Readi...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1315 (Link to this contribution) Clause 29: The universal postal service Amendment 81 81: Clause 29, page 14, line 37, at end inser...
Lord Hoyle | 709 c1317-8 (Link to this contribution) In supporting my noble friend once again on access points, I say that he is right that many of us we...
Lord Cotter | 709 c1317 (Link to this contribution) I support the noble Lord, Lord Clarke, in the points he has made, including that about no more closu...
Lord Hunt of Wirral | 709 c1313 (Link to this contribution) I am sure that the Minister is about to deal with my question, which could help to shorten some of t...
Lord Carter of Barnes | 709 c1312-3 (Link to this contribution) I stand duly corrected. As I was going to say, the use of the post bus service is an operational que...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1313-4 (Link to this contribution) This debate has been interesting. I am astounded that we have someone in this House who has confesse...
Lord Carter of Barnes | 709 c1313 (Link to this contribution) My apologies: as the noble Lord has said, it is an important and excellent report. I am afraid that ...
Lord Cotter | 709 c1338-9 (Link to this contribution) I thank the Minister for responding as he did. As he says, Clause 29 is extremely important and a ke...
Lord Mandelson | 709 c1337-8 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful for the opportunity to respond to the interesting comments that have been made in cont...
Lord Hunt of Wirral | 709 c1336-7 (Link to this contribution) As the noble Lord, Lord Clarke, pointed out, our Amendment 83A in this group probes a different aspe...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1336 (Link to this contribution) I support both these amendments for a very simple reason: a postal packet can be described as just a...
Lord Cotter | 709 c1335 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 82 82: Clause 29, page 15, line 2, leave out "Saturday,"
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1320-2 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 85A is a little sweeping in the way it is drafted but there is some merit in considering t...
Lord Tunnicliffe | 709 c1318-20 (Link to this contribution) Both Amendment 81, tabled by my noble friend Lord Clarke, and Amendment 85A, tabled by the noble Lor...
Lord De Mauley | 709 c1318 (Link to this contribution) These amendments raise some very important questions about what sort of network of access points wil...
Lord Hunt of Wirral | 709 c1345 (Link to this contribution) The noble Lord is; I beg leave to withdraw the amendment. Amendment 84B withdrawn. Clause 29 agree...
Lord Carter of Barnes | 709 c1344-5 (Link to this contribution) I am learning, and I appreciate the guidance from the noble Lord, Lord Hunt, that a poker face, or p...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1345-9 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 85 is quite simple. It is a recognition of the reality of the postal market. Only Royal Ma...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1345 (Link to this contribution) Clause 31: Designation of universal service provider Amendment 85 85: Clause 31, page 16, line 42,...
Lord Hunt of Wirral | 709 c1343 (Link to this contribution) That was a helpful response by the Minister. We both recognise that the purpose of these amendments ...
Lord Carter of Barnes | 709 c1340-3 (Link to this contribution) As has already been discussed today, the Government’s first priority is to secure the provision of a...
Lord Hunt of Wirral | 709 c1343-4 (Link to this contribution) This amendment seeks to explore another difference between the Bill and the Postal Services Act that...
Lord Hunt of Wirral | 709 c1343 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 84B 84B: Clause 29, page 15, line 21, at end insert— "( ) The Secretary of State may by o...
Lord Hunt of Wirral | 709 c1339-40 (Link to this contribution) I thought that the previous debate gave the Secretary of State an excellent opportunity to set out t...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1358 (Link to this contribution) I thank the noble Lord, Lord Hunt. That is all that is required in this debate—fair treatment. I co...
Lord Carter of Barnes | 709 c1352-6 (Link to this contribution) We have had an appropriately detailed discussion on a range of significant questions. I hope noble L...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1356-8 (Link to this contribution) This has been an interesting and long debate on a group of amendments and I apologise if I take a fe...
Lord Hoyle | 709 c1351 (Link to this contribution) Their representatives are here, but part of the point of having a Scottish Parliament and Welsh Asse...
Lord Hoyle | 709 c1351-2 (Link to this contribution) Well, if my noble friend is saying that they will become talking shops, that view might not be share...
Lord Hunt of Wirral | 709 c1352 (Link to this contribution) I do not want to get involved in the latter discussion but I was very interested in the amendments o...
Lord O'Neill of Clackmannan | 709 c1351 (Link to this contribution) The whole nature of devolution is about the separation of powers and responsibilities. That means th...
Lord Hoyle | 709 c1349-50 (Link to this contribution) My noble friend has said most of the things that should be said in relation to the very important am...
Lord Hoyle | 709 c1351 (Link to this contribution) I always respect my noble friend for his views, but I do not think that that view would be shared by...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 709 c1304 (Link to this contribution) I have not been involved in the detail on this but I have certainly been in the presence of the Secr...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 709 c1283-5 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 70A relates to the treatment of assets that are transferred to the Government. I shall sta...
Lord Razzall | 709 c1286 (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have listened with interest to the debates on the amendments moved by the noble Lords, L...
Lord Clarke of Hampstead | 709 c1276 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 70 70: After Clause 19, insert the following new Clause— "Protection for certain members ...
Lord Hoyle | 709 c1307-8 (Link to this contribution) I support my noble friend. Once again, he has stated the facts. Certainly, Postcomm, once it was cha...
Lord Cotter | 709 c1336 (Link to this contribution) I rise with pleasure to move the amendment and to speak to Amendment 83. I do not think that I will ...
Lord Hunt of Wirral | 709 c1339 (Link to this contribution) Amendment 84A 84A: Clause 29, page 15, line 21, at end insert— "( ) A universal postal service must...
Lord Hoyle | 709 c1299-300 (Link to this contribution) I support what my noble friend said. He is right to draw attention to what has happened in the past ...
EC documents
DIR2008/6/EC
Subjects
Disability Devolved matters Consumers Bus services Assets Bank services Closures Fees and charges EU law Investment Low incomes Northern Ireland Workplace pensions Public sector Public consultation Older people Staff Post offices Pension funds Postal services Parcels Ofcom Postal Services Commission Post Office Scotland Small businesses Regulation Shares Working hours Wales Tax allowances Taxation Trusts Rural areas Royal Mail Universal service obligation Girobank
Legislation
Postal Services Bill (HL) 2008-09
Link
View this Parliamentary proceeding on www.publications.parliament.uk