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Debate on bill on Tuesday, 2 February 2010, in the House of Commons, led by Hilary Benn. The answering member was Lord Herbert of South Downs.

Flood and Water Management Bill

Flood and Water Management Bill. Report stage. New clause 22, discussed with new clauses 16, 17, 18, debated and agreed to. New clause 2, discussed with new clauses 9 and 20, debated and withdrawn. New clause 3, discussed with new clauses 5, 7, 8, debated and withdrawn. New clause 10, discussed with new clauses 11 to 15, 19, 21, negatived. New clause 14 negatived. Third reading debate agreed to on question. Bill passed with amendments.

Secondary information

Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
505 c174-272 
Session
2009-10
Department
Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs
Legislative stage
Third reading
Report stage
Procedure
New clauses
Chamber / Committee
House of Commons chamber
Related items
Proceeding contributions
Speaker | 505 c272 (Link to this contribution) Order. It is always a pity to have to interrupt the hon. Gentleman's flow, but I must now put the Qu...
Stephen Pound | 505 c271-2 (Link to this contribution) I am not sure which great parliamentarian it was—it might even have been you, Mr. Speaker—who said t...
Show all contributions (160)
Speaker | 505 c269 (Link to this contribution) Order. Four right hon. and hon. Members are seeking to catch my eye and we have under 13 minutes to ...
Ian McCartney | 505 c269-70 (Link to this contribution) I will take a maximum of two minutes, Mr. Speaker. I welcome all aspects of the Bill, particularly ...
Nia Griffith | 505 c270 (Link to this contribution) I welcome the social tariff. Earlier today I pointed out the parallel with the council tax. It is a ...
David Drew | 505 c270-1 (Link to this contribution) I shall be brief so that my hon. Friend the Member for Ealing, North (Stephen Pound) can get in as w...
Lord Herbert of South Downs | 505 c264-6 (Link to this contribution) I thank Members on both sides of the House for their examination of the Bill and the improvements th...
Martin Horwood | 505 c266-8 (Link to this contribution) This Bill, if a little late and perhaps a little rushed—certainly today—is an important and much nee...
Dan Rogerson | 505 c268 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to my hon. Friend for giving way at this late stage, as we did not have time to talk a...
Martin Horwood | 505 c268-9 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend makes a welcome contribution and raises an important issue. I thank the Minister and...
Jamie Reed | 505 c261 (Link to this contribution) On dialogue and continued dialogue, I must note that, although we are happy that the Bill, as succes...
Hilary Benn | 505 c261 (Link to this contribution) I do, indeed, agree, and my hon. Friend makes an extremely powerful point. This Bill has shown what ...
Hilary Benn | 505 c262-4 (Link to this contribution) I agree, and I pay tribute to my hon. Friend for his work in his constituency. All Members represent...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c226 (Link to this contribution) I want to deal with some of the details, as that might answer a few of the issues that the hon. Gent...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c225-6 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady makes a good point but she anticipates what I am about to say. If she will bear with m...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c225 (Link to this contribution) I hope that the Minister will address two issues. First, the amendments rightly identify that there ...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c222-5 (Link to this contribution) I disagree fundamentally. Without veering too far off the subject of the amendments before us, I wan...
Lord Redwood | 505 c222 (Link to this contribution) I wish I shared the Minister's enthusiasm for the clarity of the Bill as drafted. It leaves plenty o...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c220-1 (Link to this contribution) Again, we have had a good and full debate. May I begin by thanking the hon. Member for Castle Point ...
Speaker | 505 c220 (Link to this contribution) Order. The hon. Gentleman is now straying rather wide of the group of amendments that we are discuss...
John McDonnell | 505 c226 (Link to this contribution) I welcome the Minister's response, which I am finding extremely constructive. However, the power to ...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c226 (Link to this contribution) I think that it would be helpful to sit down and go through these matters in advance of the Lords de...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c229 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time.
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c228 (Link to this contribution) Being mindful of our discussion, the hour and the debates yet to come, and with the proviso that we ...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c227 (Link to this contribution) Yes, and I am saying that we already have the necessary power. However, we should have a good look a...
John McDonnell | 505 c227 (Link to this contribution) To clarify the matter, my proposal is designed to enable the Bill to be completely flexible, with a ...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c227 (Link to this contribution) That is exactly the point that I was addressing. The project is designed to identify the gaps in the...
Angela Watkinson | 505 c227 (Link to this contribution) Will the Minister respond to the specific point that firefighters should not be expected to respond ...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c231 (Link to this contribution) I shall make some introductory remarks before speaking specifically to our group of proposed changes...
Martin Salter | 505 c232 (Link to this contribution) Do I have to go back to my constituents—some 1,000 electors—on the Haddocks estate in Tilehurst, who...
Martin Horwood | 505 c213 (Link to this contribution) The right hon. Gentleman makes an eloquent point. The spirit of it is exactly right. It underlines t...
Lord Redwood | 505 c213 (Link to this contribution) Is not one of the problems with this whole area that we can all get access to lots more experts, mem...
Martin Horwood | 505 c212-3 (Link to this contribution) I shall continue the spirit of cross-party friendship by expressing support for new clauses 2 and 9....
Lembit Opik | 505 c209 (Link to this contribution) The point about responsibility is important. Does the hon. Gentleman agree that the Environment Agen...
Laurence Robertson | 505 c208-9 (Link to this contribution) Perhaps I should ask my right hon. Friend to discuss that point with my hon. Friend. I think that he...
Greg Knight | 505 c208 (Link to this contribution) I also support new clause 2, but does my hon. Friend agree that it would be better if it provided fo...
John McDonnell | 505 c211-2 (Link to this contribution) I was present, and I apologise to the right hon. Gentleman. I did not nod off, but I must have been ...
Greg Knight | 505 c211 (Link to this contribution) Was the hon. Gentleman in the House on 15 December last year for the Second Reading debate? When I i...
John McDonnell | 505 c210-1 (Link to this contribution) I support the proposals of my hon. Friend the Member for Stroud (Mr. Drew) and others. During this ...
Laurence Robertson | 505 c209-10 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman makes a good point. It reminds me of another incident in my constituency, which p...
Lord Redwood | 505 c218-9 (Link to this contribution) I think that was a compliment, but I cannot be sure. The hon. Gentleman's well prepared support is w...
Martin Horwood | 505 c218 (Link to this contribution) I can reassure the right hon. Gentleman that if he had tabled any amendments, the notes on those wou...
Martin Horwood | 505 c214-5 (Link to this contribution) I am absolutely in agreement with the hon. Gentleman on that. In fact he could have taken the words ...
Laurence Robertson | 505 c214 (Link to this contribution) Does the hon. Gentleman agree that it was greatly beneficial at the time that the three emergency se...
Roger Williams | 505 c216 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Lady raises a very important point about the fire and rescue service. The mid and west Wale...
Angela Watkinson | 505 c215-6 (Link to this contribution) I rise to speak briefly to new clause 20, for which I have a great deal of sympathy, not least becau...
Lord Redwood | 505 c217-8 (Link to this contribution) I welcome in particular new clause 2, tabled by my Front-Bench colleagues. First, I welcome the fact...
Angela Watkinson | 505 c216 (Link to this contribution) I thank the hon. Gentleman for that intervention. It serves to clarify that in emergency situations ...
Lord Redwood | 505 c218 (Link to this contribution) Exactly. I am sure that the Minister is upset that the notes on the Government amendments are only o...
Bob Spink | 505 c219-20 (Link to this contribution) I have an Environment Agency that is pragmatic and is out there working right this moment, looking a...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c249 (Link to this contribution) I think that this may be a genuine misunderstanding. If the hon. Lady seeks confirmation that water ...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c248 (Link to this contribution) I wonder whether the points that the hon. Lady raises, on which Water UK seeks clarification, relate...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c248-9 (Link to this contribution) My understanding is both. In this group, the issue of connections is relevant. If this is a misunder...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c248 (Link to this contribution) Indeed. I have dealt with many of the issues and I am coming to the end of my comments. I am checkin...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c248 (Link to this contribution) I am extremely disappointed by the Minister's latter remarks because it was our understanding, and t...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c251-2 (Link to this contribution) Let me deal first with the Government amendments. I find it difficult to understand the logic of ame...
Speaker | 505 c250-1 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss the following: new clause 11—Resilience of individual pro...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c250 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time.
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c249 (Link to this contribution) I think that we shall have to agree to disagree, but like other hon. Members, I want the House to be...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c249 (Link to this contribution) That is, I think, a genuine point of difference. I have explained, although possibly not to the hon....
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c249 (Link to this contribution) That is very helpful, but I still do not quite understand the logic of what the Minister said in res...
Martin Horwood | 505 c252-3 (Link to this contribution) Given the limited time available, I shall speak to new clause 14, which I want to press to a Divisio...
Lembit Opik | 505 c253 (Link to this contribution) While very much agreeing with my hon. Friend's observations, does he agree that the objective of the...
Martin Horwood | 505 c253-4 (Link to this contribution) Typically, my hon. Friend is absolutely right. It is in the interests of insurance companies themsel...
Ian McCartney | 505 c254 (Link to this contribution) I thank the Front Benchers for giving me the opportunity to speak. I should tell the Minister that n...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c255 (Link to this contribution) In the time remaining—I thank right hon. and hon. Members for keeping their contributions short—I sh...
Ian McCartney | 505 c255 (Link to this contribution) I will ensure that my remarks are kept for that first meeting then and give other hon. Members the c...
Nia Griffith | 505 c261 (Link to this contribution) Does my right hon. Friend agree that this Bill has been one of the most outstanding examples of co-o...
Hilary Benn | 505 c260-1 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That the Bill be now read the Third time. I thank hon. Members from all parts of the...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c254 (Link to this contribution) I think I can do better than that. I applaud my right hon. Friend and others for pushing this issue ...
Ian McCartney | 505 c254 (Link to this contribution) So long as I am one of those interested MPs.
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c232 (Link to this contribution) I think that the hon. Gentleman and I are arguing the same case. I want the Minister to confirm that...
Maria Miller | 505 c232-3 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend agree that the lack of consultation of these people is symptomatic of the Govern...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c232 (Link to this contribution) I am calling not for a delay, but for a sense of urgency. The hon. Gentleman's Government have delay...
Martin Salter | 505 c232 (Link to this contribution) I am in no way impugning the hon. Lady's motives—if she wants to speak up for these contractors, she...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c236 (Link to this contribution) Indeed, the Minister responded in that debate by saying that he could not accept the definition that...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c233-6 (Link to this contribution) I entirely agree with my hon. Friend. In some areas, water companies know about this and are ready t...
Martin Horwood | 505 c236 (Link to this contribution) The amendments address hugely important issues. I am concerned, however, that there are real problem...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c240-2 (Link to this contribution) I am tempted to say that new clause 3 and the Bill are for the people of Hatton and Hilton in the co...
Mark Todd | 505 c239-40 (Link to this contribution) Hon. Members will know that I have spoken on flooding issues at various times in my parliamentary ca...
Maria Miller | 505 c237-9 (Link to this contribution) I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Vale of York (Miss McIntosh) on moving this important g...
Martin Horwood | 505 c236-7 (Link to this contribution) I am not sure whether that intervention was addressed to me or the Minister, but anyway, the hon. La...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c242 (Link to this contribution) The Minister has focused on the pilot schemes, but will he address my remarks about the guidance and...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c242-3 (Link to this contribution) I agree with the intention behind the hon. Lady's comments, but not with her amendments. Let me deal...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c243 (Link to this contribution) I do not know whether others in the House are aware of this, but the Minister had a series of discus...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c245 (Link to this contribution) I am sure that the Minister will find his place and respond to my earlier queries in due course, but...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c246 (Link to this contribution) I am delighted that the Minister is confirming what we already know about the Environment Agency bei...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c246-8 (Link to this contribution) We are trying to achieve the same end, and we debated the matter in depth in Committee. The water co...
Martin Horwood | 505 c248 (Link to this contribution) We have little time remaining, so I want to ask the Minister a question. He mentions many consultati...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c248 (Link to this contribution) I will finish there and give way to the hon. Gentleman.
Laurence Robertson | 505 c207-8 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman is correct. I hope that we will return to that issue soon—although it would have ...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c203-4 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful for your guidance, Mr. Deputy Speaker. We have some sympathy with the amendments in t...
David Drew | 505 c204 (Link to this contribution) I am delighted to speak to new clause 20 and amendments 24 to 27. I heard what the hon. Member for V...
Bob Spink | 505 c204 (Link to this contribution) My constituents would expect me to be totally supportive of the hon. Gentleman's amendments and new ...
David Drew | 505 c204-5 (Link to this contribution) I thank the hon. Gentleman, although he has pulled the rug from under me, because the nub of what I ...
Lembit Opik | 505 c205 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman knows more than most about how important it is to get such matters right. I am li...
David Drew | 505 c205-7 (Link to this contribution) It is the duty of the fire and rescue authorities to provide that equipment, those skills and the ca...
Laurence Robertson | 505 c207 (Link to this contribution) It is an honour to follow the hon. Member for Stroud (Mr. Drew) who, as I am sure the House would ag...
Lembit Opik | 505 c207 (Link to this contribution) Although we must not deviate too far from the amendment, does the hon. Gentleman agree that these an...
Speaker | 505 c203 (Link to this contribution) Order. For the sake of clarification, may I say to the hon. Lady that she moved the new clause at th...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c202-3 (Link to this contribution) I am most grateful for that support from my right hon. Friend. There is an argument that the Governm...
Lord Redwood | 505 c202 (Link to this contribution) That goes to the heart of a big problem in my constituency, where the rivers Emm and Loddon have flo...
Speaker | 505 c200-1 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss the following: new clause 9—Staffing and resources for th...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c201-2 (Link to this contribution) I wish to make one or two general remarks at the outset before going through our amendments and thos...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c199 (Link to this contribution) That is a valid point, and it is one thing that we will want to examine in considering the role of O...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c199 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time.
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c197-9 (Link to this contribution) The answer is a straightforward yes. I was pleased to have a very productive meeting with my hon. F...
Dan Rogerson | 505 c199 (Link to this contribution) In considering how that framework will work, will the Minister also continue to consider how compani...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c196-7 (Link to this contribution) The hon. Gentleman gives me the opportunity to put on record how we see the proposals working. Ofwat...
Martin Horwood | 505 c197 (Link to this contribution) I hope that the House will forgive my pressing this point. In fact, just for once, it is not the min...
Martin Horwood | 505 c196 (Link to this contribution) The explicit assurance that I and the Scout Association were looking for, however, was on the exerci...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c196 (Link to this contribution) I shall return to that issue in a moment. I believe that such powers exist—not in this Bill, but und...
Lord Redwood | 505 c196 (Link to this contribution) I am very grateful to the Minister for being so helpful, but will he answer my query? Does the law a...
Nia Griffith | 505 c193-4 (Link to this contribution) I rise to speak in support of Government new clause 22, which will enable water companies to operate...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c194-5 (Link to this contribution) The debate has kicked us off very well indeed. As I expected, there has been a good debate on this p...
Linda Gilroy | 505 c195 (Link to this contribution) Will the Government take note of the work done by CC Water, in the context of the water review, to a...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c195-6 (Link to this contribution) I assure my hon. Friend that we will take that work into account. The council has done a very good s...
Lord Redwood | 505 c190-1 (Link to this contribution) I think that that is what I said in slightly different language. I said that not many people would b...
Linda Gilroy | 505 c191-3 (Link to this contribution) I welcome the work that other Members have done in Committee and it is good to see the Bill back to ...
Roger Williams | 505 c187 (Link to this contribution) I am very much in favour of the hon. Gentleman's argument, but if we take Welsh Water, for instance,...
David Drew | 505 c186-7 (Link to this contribution) I am delighted to speak to new clauses 16 and 17. In the spirit prevailing in the House today, I com...
Lord Redwood | 505 c189 (Link to this contribution) I rise to discuss Government new clause 22. As I have said in interventions, we all feel well dispos...
David Drew | 505 c187-9 (Link to this contribution) That is a particular problem. We have seen contractualisation in all manner of industries, and I alw...
Lord Redwood | 505 c185 (Link to this contribution) The issue is the level of income, because I cannot persuade my fairly poor constituents to have a bi...
Martin Horwood | 505 c185-6 (Link to this contribution) The right hon. Gentleman makes a fair point. Some of the figures put forward by Thames Water, which ...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c183-4 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to my right hon. Friend for that comment. We are doing some serious work in that regar...
Martin Horwood | 505 c184-5 (Link to this contribution) I would like to start by echoing the remarks of the Minister and the hon. Member for Vale of York (M...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c181-3 (Link to this contribution) I hope the hon. Gentleman agrees. Basically, as the Minister said, the Select Committee on Environm...
Lord Redwood | 505 c183 (Link to this contribution) Has my hon. Friend considered how the introduction of proper competition into the water industry, fo...
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 505 c181 (Link to this contribution) I echo the Minister's comments—I am delighted to be at the remaining stages of the Bill, and I hope ...
Mike Penning | 505 c181 (Link to this contribution) May I be assured, from what the Minister has said, that groups in my constituency are safe, particul...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c178-9 (Link to this contribution) That is a helpful intervention, and I take my hon. Friend's point on board. In defining the review's...
Linda Gilroy | 505 c179 (Link to this contribution) I thank my hon. Friend for being so generous in giving way. He was kind enough to attend a reception...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c179-80 (Link to this contribution) Indeed there are, but that should be considered as part of the review of Ofwat's powers and duties. ...
Lembit Opik | 505 c180 (Link to this contribution) I thank the Minister for his generosity in giving way; it just so happens that the three key points ...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c177-8 (Link to this contribution) The right hon. Gentleman makes a very good point, but that is absolutely why the Bill should not inc...
Lord Redwood | 505 c177 (Link to this contribution) In appraising the proposal, it is crucial that we know how the Minister defines people""who would ha...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c177 (Link to this contribution) I shall give way first to my right hon. Friend the Member for Scunthorpe (Mr. Morley), and then to t...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c177 (Link to this contribution) Entirely. That is exactly why we have introduced the new clause in its current form. In effect, we a...
Elliot Morley | 505 c177 (Link to this contribution) I too welcome the new clause, because we need to clarify social tariffs on water use. Indeed, we hav...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c176 (Link to this contribution) I do confirm that that will indeed be Ofwat's position; the hon. Gentleman is right to raise the mat...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c175-6 (Link to this contribution) There are safeguards in the new clause, which I will come to in a moment. They include the requireme...
Lembit Opik | 505 c176 (Link to this contribution) It would be remiss of me not to praise my hon. Friend the Member for Cheltenham (Martin Horwood) for...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c174 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That the clause be read a Second time.
Lembit Opik | 505 c175 (Link to this contribution) I have one question on that specific point. I applaud the Government for taking on board the feedbac...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c175 (Link to this contribution) May I take this opportunity, now that we have come out of Committee, to thank the Opposition Front-B...
Speaker | 505 c174-5 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss the following: new clause 16—Training and development of ...
Roger Williams | 505 c227 (Link to this contribution) As I see it, the problem goes beyond resources such as the pumps and boats needed for rescues, to in...
Speaker | 505 c229-31 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to discuss the following: New clause 5—Sustainable urban drainage sy...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c243-5 (Link to this contribution) Indeed. I shall be happy to respond to that point in full. However, let me make a little bit of prog...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c180-1 (Link to this contribution) I do not think I need to write to the hon. Gentleman, because I can happily confirm that one of the ...
Bob Spink | 505 c220 (Link to this contribution) I am delighted that you allowed me to go as far as you did, Madam Deputy Speaker. I commend you for ...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c181 (Link to this contribution) Yes, the hon. Gentleman absolutely can have that assurance. We hoped that we would be able to ensure...
Linda Gilroy | 505 c178 (Link to this contribution) Will my hon. Friend consider whether that review might cover mergers? Water companies are not curren...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c227-8 (Link to this contribution) Indeed, but the fire and rescue services are not the only ones that need to be resourced. In Cumbria...
Huw Irranca-Davies | 505 c245-6 (Link to this contribution) Yes, absolutely. The hon. Lady makes a good point. I can confirm that the water and sewerage compani...
Martin Horwood | 505 c189 (Link to this contribution) I am sure that the right hon. Gentleman was listening carefully, but that is not what I said. I said...
Subjects
Consumers Debts Coastal areas Capital investment Housing Finance Fees and charges Flood control Liability Infrastructure Land drainage Insurance Inland waterways Emergency services Fire and rescue services Equipment Environment Agency Floods Private sector Low incomes Ofwat Planning permission Recruitment Public consultation Protective clothing Staff Standards Sewage Training Small businesses Regulation Sustainable development Repairs and maintenance Water companies Sewers Scouts and guides Consumer Council for Water Social tariffs
Legislation
Flood and Water Management Bill 2009-10
Link
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